4.2 24v manual gearbox fault

Hello,
can anyone help I have just bought an 80 series 4.2 landcruiser, there is a fault trying to change down from 3rd to 2nd it's very difficult, almost impossible, there's no crunchy/whining noises, it's ok when engine off, changes great from 1st to 2nd
any ideas am based in the lake district
thanks

Hi Chappers, what year is your 80? the 2nd gear syncro is an Achilles heel as far as 80 LC's go which was not corrected by Toyota until sometime in 96. My 95 GS suffered the same fault even though it had only done 83K. I had the 2nd gear sycro replaced and while it is better it isn't great. One thing you can try which may help ( it did for me) is to drain the oil out of the gearbox and refill with ATF. It is lighter than gear oil and seems to help with the changes but won't hurt the box, you can also learn to double de clutch to change down to second or changing down from 3rd just touch it into 1st Just enough for the synchromesh to work and it will drop straight into 2nd. this is just using the 1st gear syncro to do the job of the 2nd gear one.
The long term answer is to transplant a later box into your Cruiser. This problem is a case of pot luck as it does not affect all boxes.
Hope this helps.

Andy

AndycruiserguyLomas said:

Hi Chappers, what year is your 80? the 2nd gear syncro is an Achilles heel as far as 80 LC's go which was not corrected by Toyota until sometime in 96. My 95 GS suffered the same fault even though it had only done 83K. I had the 2nd gear sycro replaced and while it is better it isn't great. One thing you can try which may help ( it did for me) is to drain the oil out of the gearbox and refill with ATF. It is lighter than gear oil and seems to help with the changes but won't hurt the box, you can also learn to double de clutch to change down to second or changing down from 3rd just touch it into 1st Just enough for the synchromesh to work and it will drop straight into 2nd. this is just using the 1st gear syncro to do the job of the 2nd gear one.
The long term answer is to transplant a later box into your Cruiser. This problem is a case of pot luck as it does not affect all boxes.
Hope this helps.

Andy

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Fully agree with Andy, its actually a problem with ALL Toyota boxes of that era.

It takes a little practice, but I guarantee it isn't as bad as you think it is now once you get the hang of it!

Changing the oil in the box may help

I agree with the above, my gearbox when cold does not like changing down from 3rd to 2nd and also, strangely, up from 3rd to 4th, when stationary with engine on or off it is as sweet as a peach, double declutching makes it easier to get gears and sometimes passengers comment, always entertaining trying to explain syncromesh and the art of matching road speed, rpm and gears via double declutch.

Going up the box, mine is smooth except for the synchro on third when it clunks in rather than a silent entry. Coming down the box, it's third to second gear that gives me the clunk.

Double de-clutch solves coming down the box.

I've got the added problem of what I think are raspy bearings, meaning that first & second gear sound raspy when crawling in traffic, for example.

Otherwise, it works fine.

When very cold, meaning -20C, all the gears are a pig until warmed up a bit.

Thanks all ^^^ it's a 1995 model, will try again tomorrow, booked in Tuesday to have oil changed

Tried doubling the clutch but that didn't help

Chappers said:

Tried doubling the clutch but that didn't help

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You need to keep practicing the shift

Its about the only 'crap' thing in them!

My daily driver is very, very bad but I can fly up and down through the gears because there is a 'knack' to it. Its hilarious trying to watch someone else trying to drive it, they usually have to stop to get second gear!

You will get used to it, once its not jumping out of gear, it is only a case of getting the hang of it. Try going from 3, aiming for first (push the shift as far into first as you can without actually going into gear) and slam it straight back into second, all with the clutch depressed.

Adjusting the clutch may help either, but to be honest I have yet to drive a manual diesel Toyota with a nice few miles on it that isn't a bit of a pig to change gear on from that era. Pretend your driving an old tractor!! Thats what its like for me!

Must say,aside from a bit of a clonk going into third mine is fine after 5 mins driving. Having changed the oil in it a couple days ago, I can't see any difference at all (except that I now know the right oil is in it, and the right amount of oil because I did it myself!!

To use the 1st gear synco you only need to touch 1st before dropping into 2nd, it always works. My GS was stood up by the previous owner because of this problem amd it had only done 83K and he bought an auto Collie. Changing the oil for synthetic may help but the result wont be as good as ATF. If ATF doesnt improve it then its a new 2nd gear syncro unit needed.. This problem is random as a guy in the next village whose 94 80 I maintain's gearbox is very slick at 145K and has always been good. Best answer is to fit a later known good box, the Cruiser will be transformed. I have pretty much had autos and the GS was my !st manual, I wasn't impressed,but my 97 GX with the later type box I cannot drive enough.
Keep us informed.

Andy

A

I don't know if the early 12 valves had a different box but they must do as I drove a high mileage one and the gear change was as good as a modern car.

Yes I concur Frank. the red Cruiser I sold Stu (91 vintage) had a great box in it. It was'nt as slick as the 97-8 boxes but was far better than the 93-96's.

Andy

AndycruiserguyLomas said:

Yes I concur Frank. the red Cruiser I sold Stu (91 vintage) had a great box in it. It was'nt as slick as the 97-8 boxes but was far better than the 93-96's.

Andy

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So have I understood this correctly, up to 92 the boxes were good, not so good between 93-96, and then better 97 on?

Maybe I should be looking for a good used one, are they interchangeable between those year bands?

Yes they are interchangeable Clive, although 97-8 boxes are rare to find as they are in the newest 80's ans least likely to be broken. Its one of the main reasons I bought the 97 Amazon the other week, apart from the box, which is in great condition, it provided me with a ton of spares for my Identical GX. The box will be fitted in my GS and I might like it then. Also it gives me a transfer box with a VC as the GS's dont have that but also the props which are different as well.

Andy

Thanks Andy