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Engine Diagnosis / Overhaul

Sudo

New Member
Joined
Jul 19, 2015
Messages
8
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australia
Hi everyone.. can't say I'm exactly excited to be here - My mother and fathers 80s Series 1HD-T GXLs (Body 640xxx, Engine 100xxx) decided to go Kaput while I was taking it to the old workshop I did half of my apprenticeship in for a pink slip!!! :(

Engine has had extremely low oil pressure for months - despite my constant nagging about a diesel engines oil pressure it was not overhauled and eventually disaster has struck.

All started with my father making me put Engine Cleaner and Injector Cleaner through the motor. Ugh, was gut wrenching when I was doing it knowing what was going to happen but fathers know everything.

Anyway - I got 100m down the road after putting in the Injector Cleaner and heard a very noticeable tick / predetonation so I pulled over, wasn't coming from Crank Case but from the head - put it down to pre-det and kept driving, got another 50m and the tick completely went away and I was able to drive for the next 5km without any hickups. Cresting over a hill, the knock started to come back and only went away under acceleration.. Knock was getting louder and as I crested the hill I disengaged the clutch and let the vehicle coasts, this was the end of the line for the motor. Wouldn't rev match, sounded like I had lost 3 or more cyl and was hearing what I could have sworn sounded like a con rod bashing against the crank case over and over again. Turned the engine off (as it was still trying to idol, F**king tough bitch) and waited for the tow truck. 2hrs and a screaming match with a police officer later, I was on the way to taking the cruiser back to my temporary workshop I set up when things go wrong.

After taking the head cover off - everything looked fine other than the typical dirty sludge diesel engine oil protruding from every orifice. Grreeeeeeat I thought, onto the crank case. Now.. I haven't had the chance to vent my frustration yet so..

IT TOOK ME TWO F**KING DAYS TO GET THE SUMP PAN OFF! Hours and hours of slicing away at the RTV silicon gasket the wonderful Mechanics my parents took it to last time (who also forgot to do up a pully and snapped the brand new cam in our brand new head which is why I'm doing the work myself) - bashing the side of the pan with a hammer and a bit of wood with the small leverage I could get and eventually had to get a bottle jack, wedge the sucker between the chassis and the sump and just started cranking until I could hear the silicon starting to give way, TWO MORE FKING HOURS LATER the pan finally pops off and I observe what appears to be quite a healthy bottom end, but a multitude of metal shavings all the way through the pan.

My next job is replacing the oil pump which I haven't even looked at yet, I just got the pan off and called it quits for yesterday - but I did see heaps of fine metal shavings all the way through the oil pick up. I plan on uploading some high quality photos so you guys can tell me what you think, and any advice on this oil pump & anything else that is springing to your mind will be greatly appreciated as I've never worked on a 1HD-T before so I'm in the dark at the present!

Thank you guys in advance, AND DON'T EVER LET ANYONE WORK ON YOUR DIESEL! :icon-redface: :angry-nono:
 
That's a real shame to hear mate, not something you want happening after a rebuild not long before (for an older diesel).
I can understand the frustration of getting that pan off, but if you really want to test your patience then remove the alloy cast pan off a ZD30. You need a 44 gallon drum for a swear jar.

But just on your last sentence, try not to let one experience from maybe one mechanic tarnish all in your perception of others. I assume you are a qualified mechanic and proud of your skills and workmanship. There are many, many others out there who can quite rightly claim to being proud of theirs. This one episode, or maybe others, shouldn't be used to judge other guys working hard, applying competent skills and taking care with their work.
Plus some guys here aren't mechanics and understand it is best to let someone else do the work, so it makes sense for a professional basket weaver to let a diesel mechanic change his oil.

I understand you are probably very frustrated, but it's not fair to curse the rest of the field. Just saying. :icon-wink:
 
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If you use the proper tool, the sump comes off fairly easy. Why are you replacing the oil pump, thats the least of your problems!
 
Sounds like your big ends have failed. A common problem well documented here and in os. Unless you are an experienced motor man you'll struggle to put it right. Another engine would be a better alternative. Change the big end shells before you put it in.
 
so it makes sense for a professional basket weaver to let a diesel mechanic change his oil.

I understand you are probably very frustrated, but it's not fair to curse the rest of the field. Just saying. :icon-wink:

110% on the mark, frustration is getting the better of me.
I needed that. Thanks for the laugh!

Still chasing info on the oil pump /assembly. I can't seem to find any info, I've been searching all day in between work, next step will be back to repco for a workshop manual (which I really should invest in anyway)

Also, here is some photos of the silicon on the gasket pan. I know I promised 'HD' photos but used the closest phone available for this and all the photos it takes have a tinge of pink/red over it.

11230036_792401377525550_3796447259638496552_n.jpg11752641_792401397525548_2003497581061780832_n.jpg
 
Sorry I didn't see the other two replies for some reason - the pump is definitely not the least of my worries if the oil pressure before and after a change was negligible at best.

Big ends look healthy and were only replaced incl. pistons less that 30,000km. There is less than half a millimeter of play, negligible. I considered taking the big end shells off and taking a bit of a squizz.
 
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Uurgghhh....I can see why you're a little cheesed with the silicone job.

Now, I am in no way suggesting retaliatory action, but if you just happened to be wandering past the culprits car one day with a fully loaded silicone gun in your hand and some spilled out into his car door key hole, that would be incredibly unfortunate.
Not suggesting anything by the way, just an unfortunate coincidence should it pan out that way. :icon-cool:

Good luck getting all that goop off.
And as noted above, there are definitely more issues afoot, so take your time checking everything thoroughly. Get it right this time and she'll last another 500,000km.
Cheers
 
Maximum clearance on the big end bearings is .0039 mm. 100 times as large is still less than 1/2 mm :icon-exclaim:.
 
Maximum clearance on the big end bearings is .0039 mm. 100 times as large is still less than 1/2 mm :icon-exclaim:.

With you on this one Frank :thumbup:

The amount of silicone oozing into the sump would make it possible for the oil pickup to block?

I have used injector cleaner on ALL my vehicles on a regular basis petrol or injection, and have done for more years than I can remember....let you know when it causes a problem.


regards

Dave
 
I thought of that Dave. I'm very careful not to put too much jointing compound on engine components especially silicone as sometimes it peels off even after thorough degreasing. It's OK between clamped surfaces but the excess can fall off.

If this engine had new BE shells I wonder if they checked the crank and oil clearance directly with plastigauge ? A damaged crank might account for low oil pressure but without a rattle I doubt it. I check my pressures with a mechanical gauge. I have known faulty pressure relief valves to cause total oil pressure failure on other engines.


Metal fragments in the sump is most likely from the crank.
 
Maximum clearance on the big end bearings is .0039 mm. 100 times as large is still less than 1/2 mm :icon-exclaim:.

Okay, so not negligible - thank you!

After clearing out the sump the amount of metal shards in there was absolutely disgusting - BUT when the 'mechanics' we took the car to originally they forgot to do up a pulley up and when we cranked it over the camshaft snapped into a million pieces, and I cannot be certain they cleared the sump of all the metal fragments as it happened after they replaced all pistons ect so unlikely they took the sump back off and checked.

I went to Toyota today for gaskets and to ask about a replacement oil pump and they had the blue print with all parts I could purchase and the Pressure Release Valve is the only part the mechanic at toyota said would cause absolutely no pressure so I have those parts on order.

The type of metal in the sump looks like soft / white metal, which have no linear streaks / burns but circular, so I know they're not from the sleeves which is a mild relief.

Still taking my time with this old girl - refuse to stuff this up!

Another question, obviously turbos are meant to receive oil that's a given, but how much would you determine is too much? I feel there is way to much oil coming out of the turbo as the manifold and the pipe coming out of it was absolutely disgusting.
 
Okay, so not negligible - thank you!

After clearing out the sump the amount of metal shards in there was absolutely disgusting

and by disgusting I mean the crank couldn't continue with the amount of metal off it, some pieces were as big as 20mm in diameter. Will post a photo soon.
 
Okay so got the head off after many a beer and words no one should ever say in front of their mother.. piston #4 was in an intimate relationship with the valves.

So, while the slapping was coming from the head the culprit was infact the big end letting go and letting the piston travel past the TDC. MWAH Mr. Head!

Anyone think I could wing changing the big end without pulling out the motor? I've done it in a smaller car but it was on a hoist.
 
Yes you can change the bearing shells if the crank is not damaged which I think unlikely.

To test the crank you have to measure the diameter of the journal ALL THE WAY ROUND. I would check the manual to find the minimum acceptable diameter then check the journal with a micrometer screw gauge and if it looks OK check all the other 5 journals as a reference/double check.

No point in changing just 1 big end.

If the crank needs changing that is a major job and the motor will have to be removed to disengage from the gearbox.

Good luck and interested to see what you find.
 
That confirms what we were all thinking. Big End Bearings which are replaceable without engine removal. It sounds to me like you need to carefully check that the big end journals are not damaged in any way as this may have led to the new bearing shells that were fitted by the previous garage animals to fail. There's lots of info on here about BEBs and their swappage, what to get (ACLs) and where to get them from (Karl Webster). Main bearings don't seem to suffer so much as there's 2 per pot. There are other guys on here with far more knowledge on this than I, but in your position, I would check the journals carefully with a micrometer as well as using plastigauge in case they are oval shaped through wear. If they are, I believe it's engine out and crank regrind.

Sounds like you caught it just before ultimate disaster struck.
 
My concern here is why the bearing failed? If the oil pickup was indeed blocked (or at least partially) then I would be concerned that the rest of the engine i.e. main bearings, cam bearings and so forth would have also seen excessive wear.

I would be inclined to cut open the oil filter and see what the condition is inside, see what particles (if any) have been trapped in there. If all good then go with Franks recommendations, if the filter is gummed up and then it is possible there is other debris in the galleries (pre filter) waiting to block things up again after the rebuild, ideal situation here would be a complete strip of the block and head, inspect, hot tank, and then blow out all the passages. Difficult to guarantee all would be perfect, perhaps a second hand engine would be a better option?

Keep us informed with progress.

regards

Dave
 
I was thinking what Dave just said. You're half way to a full rebuild at this stage anyway. If it's debris that's caused it, it should show stuck to the oil pick up gauze if there's anything large in there. Two routes, neither of them are cheap. Personally, I would self rebuild and verify everything, but a good second hand engine with known history would be very tempting, possibly cheaper and less work.

This is a sad thing to happen to a Cruiser [emoji22]
 
Complete lack of oil pressure surprises me. I've only seen this with an incorrectly fitted pressure relief valve. Also regarding a blocked pick up, possibly, but I did work on an engine once that had 140 PSI but the pick up was resting on the bottom of a flat aluminium sump as the wrong sump had been fitted. In fact the vibration had ground a perfect pick up rim shape in the sump but still the oil pressure was not affected. I was on the Mway once and my pressure dropped from 60 psi to 25 psi so turned back and headed home. 20 miles and home I found the crankshaft was broken across the front web! No noises and no failed bearings.
 
Big end says 'Bon Voyage bitches'

No noises and no failed bearings.
Wish I was that lucky!!!

I foolishly only checked cyl 1 - 2 - 5 - 6 because of the positioning of the pistons. After removing the 1st cap, the bearing looked fine, but as cyl 3 & 4 weren't at TDC I could check them... and cylinder 4 half of 1 bearing left, and has completely rooted the journal.

Engine must come out. :angry-screaming::eusa-dance::violence-shootself:


More updates soon... & will post a photo of the bearing that's completely and utterly ground to a pulp, I'm going back out to the shed to keep the dream alive.
 
Sorry.. that was a little bit illiterate from my morning brainwaves.

Cylinder 4 only had half a bearing left leaving huge amounts of play. The piston was traveling too far up the cylinder and making out with my valves, which luckily are unscathed.

What F***S me is how 1 bearing out of 6 can fatally give in yet all other 5 bearings are fine. Could incorrect fitment have played a roll here? These bearings have done less than 20,000km and should not be worn.

I have a new pressure release to install when I've pulled everything off the motor which I am in the process of doing. This has all turned into a major stuff up.
 
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