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Custom Landcruiser Build Help or am I just day dreaming

1965TLCFJ45LVWagon

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Hello everyone

I am looking for help with a custom Landcruiser build BUT I have little experience of owning a Landcruiser (hence the title of this thread). The only things I know come from reading the history of the Landcruiser on the Toyota website and various articles on a couple of forums – so please bear with me on this…

I decided to do this after a close friend bought 3 Landcruiser 60 series (not at once) and I got the chance to drive them. I then started looking online at the 40 and 60 series and found that they are very hard to get in the UK. Furthermore, the same friend has suggested driving from the UK through Africa.

I am looking to see if we can take the best parts of the various Landcruiser series and create one which is best for driving through somewhere like the African continent e.g. the chassis from an 80 series, the engine from a 60 series, etc… brand new braking system, … etc…

As such, I have a few questions which I have outlined below and would be grateful if I could get some answers or suggestions:

1. What is the difference between overlanding and off-roading? I have tried googling this but haven’t come across a decent explanation.


2. For driving in somewhere like Africa where roads might be badly worn or just dirt tracks, what would be the best chassis to start building on? I mean, what series of TLC would have the best chassis for this kind of journey.


3. What would be the most reliable engine to use ? I would prefer something which has as little electronics as possible in the hope that it is easier to maintain or repair when there are no professional service stations about. Any comments on the fuel efficiency of the earlier TLC engines vs the later ones would be greatly appreciated.

These are all the starter questions for now… but whilst browsing online, I found this a Landcruiser FJ45LV wagon on vintageoffroad (I cannot post the url because I’m new)… and fell in love with it… unfortunately it is sold but I would be looking at this type of body on the finished product if at all possible.

Finally, if you are wondering about the strange time this message was posted, that is because I am in China at the moment looking for aftermarket Landcruiser parts for a friend (whose latest purchase is a rusty shed of a Landcruiser off ebay) and for some other business. We are 8 hours ahead of the UK…

Thanks everyone…

Adam
 
This is a pic of the one off vintageoffroad...
 

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Welcome to the club. :icon-biggrin:

Overlanding is driving big distances across countries. Generally the goal is to explore different countries and to be able to drive all roads/tracks and not be forced to stick to the bitumen. So you might be going to Morocco for example where you might be driving across sand dunes, or through ice and snow in Iceland etc. Overlanding is all about adventure and people do huge trips around the world in their 4wd's and on motorbikes.

Off-roading is more about driving something because its challenging and fun, the sort of driving you should aim to avoid on an overland trip as you want to complete your huge journey, so you dont want to risk damaging the vehicle potentially thousands of miles from home.
Generally off-roading takes place on private land and in disused quarries.

The best chassis would be an 80 series one! (in actual fact the best LandCruiser for that sort of trip would be an 80.)

But I understand you might prefer the retro, iconic look of a 40 series! :icon-cool:

You could use a 60 series chassis and you would have a bigger stronger front diff than an 80 series, but the ride quality wouldn't be anywhere near as comfortable as an 80 as 60's are leaf spring.

The later 60 series had one of the best engines Toyota have ever produced the 12HT! These engines are basically bomb proof! So long as they get regular oil changes the engines will go for 500,000+ kms before needing a rebuild and even then it should only need bearings and seals. You should also get spare parts all over the world quite easily, not that you should need them. Its quite a basic straight 6 diesel truck engine and very reliable. :thumbup:
 
Hi and welcome I wood love one of them I love the 40's go for it big :thumbup: from Tony and let's have pice.
 
A big THANK YOU to Ben and Tony for their advice and encouragement...

I posted the same thread on TLOCUK and haven’t got any replies yet… :icon-cry: if you know of other suitable forums, please let me know. I am just starting off so please forgive the basic questions…

First of all, I think I would be looking at the overlanding rather than the off-roading. The car needs to be able to handle all sorts of roads…

Back to the project… I am having some pics sent across from the UK of the 60 series and will post them as soon as I get them.

In the meantime, a few more questions:

Having an engineering background, I always like to over-engineer things meaning that I want to be 200% sure that the final product with withstand everything I throw at it. As such, I would prefer to go with a 60 series chassis as it should be stronger (from what Ben has said above).

As for ride quality, what is the alternative to leaf springs? For example, what is used on the 80 series? Is one better than the other for overlanding ?

If the alternative is better than leaf springs, can the 60 series chassis be modified to accept the alternative?

Also, Ben mentioned that the 60 series have a bigger stronger diff than the 80 series – might be a silly question, but can I ask why this is important?

With regard to braking system, what would be the best option? I have no idea so am really open to suggestions on this.

As mentioned before, I really love the 1965 Toyota FJ45LV Wagon body pic which I posted earlier so with that in mind…

1. First of all would it be possible to fit such a 40 series body on a 60 series chassis and what possible modifications would be needed?

2. Does anyone have any links to technical information on this FJ45LV body (or vehicle)? I mean things like dimensions, how it is put together, etc… I just wanted to get as much info as possible before embarking on this in more detail.

3. Are there any UK (or even non UK) body panel suppliers who might be able to make the whole body if I cannot find suitable FJ45LV to break up?

I am trying to get the best chassis and mechanical bits for overlanding (strongest and most reliable with little modern electrnic gadgetry) but for the interior, I would be looking to make it more up-to-date with better seating, new instrument panels, etc… I am hoping that this would be easier than the chassis and mechanical bits…

That is all for today… I want to slowly absorb the info and make the right decisions.

Thanks again !
 
Welcome to the forum!

Before you read on, in this post, I'm neither an engineer nor an overlander, so anything said here is just an opinion, and not to be taken as knowledge on the subject.

I've read with interest several builds which try to take the best of various models to suit the purpose of the owner and the intended use of the vehicle.

From what ive seen, I've not got the impression that the 60 series chassis is any stronger than the 80 chassis, and the debate as to the strength of leaf springs over coil springs will probably continue to the end of time. What is clear (from my experience) is that coil springs give more comfort to the ride, and I would think that in itself should be high on the priority list for an overland build.

So that would suggest the starting point would be an 80 chassis complete with its coil spring configuration. The 80 series Diesel engine is well proven, whether in the normally aspirated HZJ (mine) or the more powerful HDJ (UK Spec) turbo version. So I see no reason to be lookiking for complicating the build with various other engine, transfer and gearbox configurations.

So that would suggest a good starting point to be an HDJ 80 (mostly RHD UK, SA or Australia). What would be your preference, RHD or LHD?

If the starting point is a UK HDJ 80, then you get the added bonus of the front and rear OEM diff lockers, which IMO would be another essential box to tick on an overland.

The next consideration would be which body to use. This must firstly be down to aesthetics. You show a strong preference for the 40 Series look. I can't argue with that, but they are getting very old and not so easy to find in good condition. The squareness of the Troopie passenger body may assist with an overland conversion, although there are many 80 series cruisers that are well converted for overlanding.

80 Series bodies are all nearing or over 20 years old now, but they have stood the test of time and good bodies are still available in the UK, SA and Australia. This begs the question, where are you? You seem to be a Brit flying the Union, but you speak as though you are elsewhere (unless I've missed something).

If you're set on the 40 Series body, then there is a very good thread on here of a mixture of 40 chassis using 80 series coils but it's a shortie intended for beach use. I'm sure as an engineer, you could "do your own thing" in that respect.

As an 80 owner I'm unashamedly biased, but the thought of over landing on hard leaf springs, would not appeal to me. However, there are many 60 Series cruisers doing just that!
IMHO, the beauty of starting with an 80 Series would be having all the chassis, engine, transmission, braking and wiring from one model, all proven tough stuff for over landing. The body would be your choice, to suit the appearance and overland conversion that you have in mind.

The UK model 80 series has disc brakes all round, and they are also a proven asset.

Again I stress that I've never done this, and really I don't know from experience what I'm talking about! :lol:

After posting, I'll try to edit in the link to the "70 on 80 coils on a 40 chassis" thread, if it's of any use (I got a bit mixed with the models here but the link is self explanatory...:icon-rolleyes:).

Good luck:thumbup:
 
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Welcome to the forum Adam.

If its overlanding that you are wanting to do, then building a vehicle from the parts of a number of other Land Cruisers is not really the way to go, as when your in the middle of nowhere you want reliability, a bitsa has to be really well designed and built to achieve this. Contrary to some peoples belief car manufacturers do actually do a good job when producing a vehicle, and sometimes that good work is undone by some poor modifications further down the line.

If you look around online and do searches on forums like this you will find that the best Land Cruiser available in the UK for overlanding is an 80 series. Unfortunately the 45 series that you have taken a liking to is an extremely rare vehicle, a collectors item really, so I don’t think it would be a good idea to start with one of them for your intended use. The 60 series is a great truck, but again rare in UK as they rust, a lot! They have been used for overlanding around the world, and are a simple and extremely tough truck. The 80 series is an evolution of the 60 and is all the better for it.

In an overland vehicle you want several factors (which are always a compromise), Reliability, Range (fuel), Comfort, Easy spares availability, Good payload, Capable both on and off the road. If you have a bitsa, or heavily modified vehicle, then you need to know it very well, as when a part is needed you have to know what vehicle it came off of, so that you can order a replacement. If the part in question is a bespoke part then it really limits your options.

The 80 series has all of the above attributes, it has a separate chassis, good suspension system (coil springs front and rear), beam axles (some with axle difflocks), a great turbo diesel engine (OEM big end bearings have to be replaced on the 12 valve, plenty of info on this subject on the forum), a comfortable interior, a large load bay, has a long wheel base so that the load can be spread out, and also gives a smoother ride, and is a fairly simple vehicle by todays standard. If you want simplicity try a manual 80. If you build your dream truck it could consume all of your time and money, leaving you with neither for the trip!

Give these forums a try as well:
http://www.ih8mud.com/

http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hubb/
 
I'm with Scott (above), not seeing the need to reinvent the wheel as it were. A fully baselined UK HDJ 80 series would be the best starting point, and spend all the money on a well thought out over landing conversion, again plenty of examples to be found on this forum.
 
Hi Adam,
Loads of good advice being proffered on here but I think that you are attracted to the older style/look. As a modified 40 series (with HJ60 engine box and axles) I can tell you, from experience, that it can be problematic to get the correct parts for a modified LC - and that's when both parties are speaking the same language.
If it were me, I'd take a serious look at the 70series - parts available throughout the known world (except perhaps the UK) and they are really an upgraded 40 and tough - very tuff.
I think you need to spend some time in a coil sprung 80 and in a 40 or 70 series. Personally I like leaf springs but as you are planning a down Africa trip it's best to know what type of ride you prefer.
Starting with a 70 series you get the 'older' look but the models are still in production and you can then devote the time, effort and money to equipping it exactly as you want.
Worth having a look at Stan's overlanding website - www.theoverlander.org - plenty of ideas and options for equipping and equipment.
Hope that helps

Regards
 
A big thanks to Clive, Scott, Firewout & Rodger !!! :thumbup:

Just to clear any confusion, I live in Manchester but do a lot of work abroad so am out of the UK quite a lot. I am posting this from China !

I am going to take some time to read up on links suggested in previous posts and then come back… It seems like I have a lot of reading to do on all sorts of things…

I did come across a website of an American company (icon4x4) who could easily get me exactly what I want but having enquired about costs, I don’t think my budget will stretch to the £150,000+ price tags they roughly start from !

Thanks again guys… going to start to try and read up on all aspects before posting again but the internet abroad is very slow and unreliable compared to the UK… and in China there are quite a few things blocked also !

Oh, nearly forgot… somehow I am drawn to the FJ45LV Wagon body shape I posted earlier and the 80 series body doesn't seem to do it for me personally…

Thanks again to everyone...
 
If you you like the 40 series look, I would also suggest a 70 series. Personally I wouldn't spend all the time and money that an overland build involves, on a 20 year old vehicle...

Have a think about the basics ie. how many people in the vehicle, what fuel range will you need, how remote will you go (determines what gear and how much food/water needs to be carried), etc, then pick a vehicle. I will add that once you get a taste for remote travel it can be quite addictive and you'll probably end up wanting a more rugged vehicle, rather than a more comfortable vehicle.
 
For offroading, people modify their trucks in order to achieve greater offroading performance, but this often comes at the expense of reliability. In overlanding, reliability is everything. A catastrophic failure can quite literally put your life at risk. To that end standard is generally best. Assuming you start with a decent vehicle, then when components fail it is nearly always something that has been modified or is an aftermarket part.

In overlanding, if your vehicle breaks down your mate can't tow it home for you so you can mend it next weekend. in the event of major component failure or some other failure you can't fix in the field you could end up having to ditch the vehicle, even if you are travelling with other vehicles, and if you can't walk out or get someone to give you a lift, you can die. It's no exaggeration, there are plenty of graves in the desert and wrecks of vehicles to prove the point.

In overlanding vehicle preservation is vital, so you actually end up trying to avoid extreme off roading because it will ultimately lead to component failure. In offroading people tend to seek out the most difficult.

So my advice would be, don't try and build the ultimate overlander, buy off the shelf and then modify to suit, but don't change the basic structure of the base vehicle. In the world of landcruiser, IMHO that means an 80 series or a 70 series (not prado as was sold in the UK but HD spec which would need to be an import)

Although my overlander is a 60, if I were starting from scratch thats not what I would get now, it would be an 80 or, if I could get one, a 70 series. An 80 offers coils springs, which make life more comfortable, and a much better engine. I'm not sure why you think the 60 engine, presumably the 2H is such a great choice (the 12HT mentioned above was never sold in the UK and is virtually unknown here). Although superbly reliable and long lived, it's also horrendously underpowered. The 4.2 turbo is a far better bet. Still reliable and much easier to live with day to day.

Chassis strength shouldn't be a factor unless you are massively overloading, in which case you are also going to have lots of other problems with other components. A rusty 60 series chassis is going to be a lot weaker than non rusty suzuki one!! start with something good that doesn't need a lot of welding, because that risks adding weak points. Any of the landcruiser chassis will be fine.

Budget is as much as you want it to be. I took a suzuki Sj413 bought for £250 to the Gambia, or you can spend the equivalent of a decent house in the south of England on an overlanding truck. It's got to be a lot tougher leaving a £250000 vehicle in the middle of nowhere than one that cost you 5k.

People have gone overlanding in what might be considered the most inappropriate vehicles. It's also a question of how many people are going to be in the vehicle, where are you going, where do you want to live (in or out of the vehicle) etc etc etc

To buy an 80, get it fully rebuilt to the required standard (bear in mind these are old vehicles now) and fit it out well for comfortable overlanding I would say you would need a budget of £30-40k, obviously if you do some of the work yourself that drops the costs, but you could just as easily buy an old truck for £5-6 and take it as is, just try and run it for a few months first to iron out any problems and get familiar with it.

Lots of people go very successfully with the budget option, for example

http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hubb/4wd-overland-travel/you-dont-need-spend-mega-78052

Whats the best vehicle is a massive question, to which there is no easy and no one answer. And in the end only you can answer it, and even then, maybe not!!
 
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Welcome to the great debate!
some really good replies on here, there's no right or wrong it's down to what's going to make your trip special. A lot of the fun is the search for 'that ' vehicle and then setting about making it as you want. I've done it with bikes, a 4x4 truck and various landcrusiers, and the reason I keep changing is the focus of each trip or the idea changes of how I want to have my set up, it's all great fun!
but from your initial post how about this..
image.jpg
its a HJ47 from Australia, 4l 6cyl 2h engine, none turbo, you can sleep in the back, does 100kph all day long, proven, reliable, it's been around the world already, I'd set off in it tomorrow without a worry.. :icon-biggrin:
Stan
 
Hey Stan, I remember you buying this (and assuming the photo is recent) one of the special things about that HJ47 is you've not made any changes to it since!

Great truck :thumbup:
 
Yep same truck, not needed to do anything ! This was taken on holiday in France in the summer.
i am however contemplating parting with it, for no other reason than a new project!
I think the less you modify something for a trip and the simpler the whole system is the less there is to worry, there is a tendency to try and cover every eventuality, I did this when I built my MAN, went overboard, over budget, but it was a family home and not just a trip and every trip/situation is different.
in Algeria in 1993 I was on a motorbike and met a German guy in a big truck who had just crossed one of the biggest areas of dunes on the planet, his advice was go on a bike and take nothing or go in a truck and take everything ! I've done both and now I would take the cruiser with not a lot and treat it like a bike trip :thumbup:
 
Mmmm, someone will buy that and "restore" it, removing all the character! It would be a shame.

One of it's main features is that it looks like it's been around the world!
 
Completely agree :icon-cool:
Someone at a show called it patina !?
(sorry for the derail people:oops:)
 
Completely agree :icon-cool:
Someone at a show called it patina !?
(sorry for the derail people:oops:)

I'm not sure it is Stan, "1965TLCFJ45LVWagon" could buy it and take it around the world (again) "as is" :lol:
 
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