None Toyota engine/trans swap

[darran1966]

i have an FJ40 fitted with the B2 Diesel engine. In the future I will be updating the engine and transmission to something more modern, unsure of the route I should go.
Looking at the layout of the FJ, the transmission I use needs to have a right hand side front output due to the off set diff of the FJ, the rear is also off set to the right of the vehicle but I assume a central output gearbox will still work with the off set diff.
After looking at other manufacturers layouts, Isuzu troopers and the rodeo pickups have the correct transmission layout. Cost wise I could purchase a whole vehicle very responsible.
Your thoughts,suggestions, advise and ideas would be appreciated. ( other Toyota 4x4 swaps if poss )

With regards to devaluing my FJ, as it is already fitted with the in correct engine for this model the value would remain the same as it is not original?
Thanks in advance.
Darran.

 

[Rodger]

Hi Darran,

Like your truck, mine is a Frankenstein but my engine, trans and axles were already installed when I bought it, however it is a early 80s 2H and therefore old technology. I suspect that you want something a bit more up to date and possibly without all of today's electrics.
From a few decades of being involved in hotrods, swaps using the same makers bits tend to be a bit easier. With that in mind using a later Toyota will undoubtedly make the job a lot more straight forward and you may be surprised e.g. my 60 series transmission sits on the original 40 series g/box cross member and the later mount fits the early holes, like it was made for it.
Recently I met a chap down here in Spain with a BJ73 which originally had the 5 cylinder VM engine which was interchangeable with the 3B and he had fitted a 1KZ-TE from a 90/95 KZJ9* but had changed the electronic fuel pump to a mechanical one. It looks brilliant - like it was made for it. (2982cc turbo inline 4 130hp 213ft/lbs).
The weight of the engine is important - my engine is 700lbs but my front suspension is modified to coils plus PS but from the photos you are on leaf springs so the weight is important to maintain decent road manners - too heavy an engine and the F-R balance will be too uneven and therefore not a good drive. The 90 series is basically a Prado (lightweight) which is more suitable for retaining road manners. Although the thought of an Isuzu or even an 80 series motor may appeal those vehicles are considerably heavier and their suspension is designed to take that extra poundage (both are over a ton+ heavier). Having said that the 40 series chassis is more than capable of taking the extra but it is the suspension that does the work.
I am friends with the chap who did the mechanical modifications to my truck and over the years he has done numerous engine swaps and his view is to stick with like manufacturers as using someone else's mechanicals brings a whole load of other problems to the point that now he will only swap later engines etc into Toyotas (his speciality).
The principles instigated by Mr T in the 20 and 40 series LCs means that engine/trans/diff relationship has not changed in all the years, so using that expensive R&D that MR T invested in and has proven to be the best merits consideration IMO. To the point that had my truck had another manufacturer's engine and box in it I would not have bought it and I've owned this for 18 years and it has been my DD for the the last 10 years.
I have a bit of base info about many of the various Toyota engines so if you want any info I should be able to supply but one important point is whatever engine you chose get the VIN number from the original vehicle as it will make getting parts so much easier.

Hope that helps.

Regards,

Rodger

 

[Paddler Ed]

A BJ40 is (sort of) right for 1984, so it might be the right engine. BJ42 is the norm here in Australia for that era.

What does the chassis number start with? If FJ, then it's had a diesel swapped in; if it starts BJ then it was built originally as a diesel.

The FJ40 applied to all of them is a habit that has come from the USA where that was what they got; from my VIN plate info, I get this number HJ45RP-KQ3; shows mine is a HJ45 - H motor, ute/troopy chassis (45), R=RHD, P-KQ3 shows mine was a chassis cab (no tub)

Double check yours, it might be a factory diesel...

 

[darran1966]

A BJ40 is (sort of) right for 1984, so it might be the right engine. BJ42 is the norm here in Australia for that era.

What does the chassis number start with? If FJ, then it's had a diesel swapped in; if it starts BJ then it was built originally as a diesel.

The FJ40 applied to all of them is a habit that has come from the USA where that was what they got; from my VIN plate info, I get this number HJ45RP-KQ3; shows mine is a HJ45 - H motor, ute/troopy chassis (45), R=RHD, P-KQ3 shows mine was a chassis cab (no tub)

Double check yours, it might be a factory diesel...

Hello, the chassis number does start FJ40, registered 01/05/1983.
I would guess it has had an engine swap.
Thanks
Darran.

 

[darran1966]

Hello Rodger, you made so

Hi Darran,

Like your truck, mine is a Frankenstein but my engine, trans and axles were already installed when I bought it, however it is a early 80s 2H and therefore old technology. I suspect that you want something a bit more up to date and possibly without all of today's electrics.
From a few decades of being involved in hotrods, swaps using the same makers bits tend to be a bit easier. With that in mind using a later Toyota will undoubtedly make the job a lot more straight forward and you may be surprised e.g. my 60 series transmission sits on the original 40 series g/box cross member and the later mount fits the early holes, like it was made for it.
Recently I met a chap down here in Spain with a BJ73 which originally had the 5 cylinder VM engine which was interchangeable with the 3B and he had fitted a 1KZ-TE from a 90/95 KZJ9* but had changed the electronic fuel pump to a mechanical one. It looks brilliant - like it was made for it. (2982cc turbo inline 4 130hp 213ft/lbs).
The weight of the engine is important - my engine is 700lbs but my front suspension is modified to coils plus PS but from the photos you are on leaf springs so the weight is important to maintain decent road manners - too heavy an engine and the F-R balance will be too uneven and therefore not a good drive. The 90 series is basically a Prado (lightweight) which is more suitable for retaining road manners. Although the thought of an Isuzu or even an 80 series motor may appeal those vehicles are considerably heavier and their suspension is designed to take that extra poundage (both are over a ton+ heavier). Having said that the 40 series chassis is more than capable of taking the extra but it is the suspension that does the work.
I am friends with the chap who did the mechanical modifications to my truck and over the years he has done numerous engine swaps and his view is to stick with like manufacturers as using someone else's mechanicals brings a whole load of other problems to the point that now he will only swap later engines etc into Toyotas (his speciality).
The principles instigated by Mr T in the 20 and 40 series LCs means that engine/trans/diff relationship has not changed in all the years, so using that expensive R&D that MR T invested in and has proven to be the best merits consideration IMO. To the point that had my truck had another manufacturer's engine and box in it I would not have bought it and I've owned this for 18 years and it has been my DD for the the last 10 years.
I have a bit of base info about many of the various Toyota engines so if you want any info I should be able to supply but one important point is whatever engine you chose get the VIN number from the original vehicle as it will make getting parts so much easier.

Hope that helps.

Regards,

Rodger

Hello Rodger, you made some valid point that I hadn’t given much though to,
I have a little experience swapping mopar engines into a valiant charger ( that was also from Australia).
Not sure of the weight of the 2B in comparison with a more modern setup that will be something for me to check upon.
I must agree a Toyota swap into a Toyota is preferable, but possibly more costly when compared to using other manufacturers vehicles.
To make the whole swap easier I will purchase a complete vehicle, I was thinking of a vehicle that is spares or repairs or accident damaged.
As I’m in no rush I can shop about, any advise on model of Toyota that would make the swap easier would be appreciated. My limited search so far is some hilux and surf models have the transfer at the right hand side of the gearbox.
My first target is to register it here in the uk(waiting for a response from Toyota Australia for a COC) then mot and use as is even if it only does 50 mph.

Regards
Darran

 

[tonytoyota]

Hi Darren I put a 2H in my fj45 out of HJ 60 I think a 3.L Colorado would be a good one good looking 40 you have good look with it you will have a lot of fun with a 40s.

 

[Rodger]

Hi Darran,

It is good that you are taking the time to look around before deciding which engine to use. I like the idea of getting the whole vehicle - accident damage or whatever - because the little bits that finally link everything together can be very expensive, so that potentially has a big cost saving.

IMO you need to decide what you want from the truck - and suspension, brakes and steering play a major role if you want more up to date comfort, speed and efficiency but bear in mind that post 2002 electrics play a far bigger role and in my view would create more problems than benefits.

Starting with the 2B you have now: originally fitted in the BJ41 and BJ44, 3168cc it produced 84hp and 148ft/lbs but it is an early 70s engine and therefore old technology. As it is from Oz it is probably 12 volt whereas many LCs are 24 volt - which doesn't make a load of difference other than the starting and charging circuits but IMO should be born in mind when looking at the engine options.
It is worth bearing in mind that Australia restricts LCs to 12 volt whereas in the rest of the world many models use 24v at least for the starter system. So worth checking the specific model details when considering an engine from a different model.

Of course the 2F was a 6 cylinder petrol - no lightweight itself - but having seen a 4.2 L from an 80 series squeezed into a 40 ... the engine sits in fine but the gearbox etc are longer and didn't sit that easily* which of course meant prop cutting and balancing. * Looking from the side the tail of the gearbox was visible below the chassis line and it didn't look that professional and was exposed.

IMO the range of 3 litre engines available from pre 2002 LCs and Hilux should give you a wide enough range to find a suitable upgrade to give excellent on road performance and, of course, brilliant OR fun.

When you view potential donors put the vin number into www.toyodiy.com and it will give you the details and, obviously, you can ask all you want on here. And a couple of websites that may be of interest for 40 and other LC bits are: euro4x4.com and megastore4x4.pt .

If you wish to bounce ideas around please feel free to do so as there are a lot of very knowledgeable people in this forum. I shall follow your progress with interest and, if I have any information that will help, just ask.

Regards,

Rodger

 

[Rodger]

What I forgot to say was before you view any potential swap vehicles measure your engine bay so that you have a three dimensional view of the space available to insert the donor. Historically we've used the bulkhead as the centre point and measured from there so that you know distances to front and rear props, gearbox mount, width at starter, chassis to top of b/h aperture, etc.
Going Toyota to Toyota will be much more straight forward and the great thing about this with a 40 is everything forward of the bulkhead unbolts giving you plenty of work space.

At the end of this month I am passing the village where the BJ73 with the 1KZ-TE is kept. I will try and get photos if you think will help.

Regards,

Rodger

 

[darran1966]

Hi Darren I put a 2H in my fj45 out of HJ 60 I think a 3.L Colorado would be a good one good looking 40 you have good look with it you will have a lot of fun with a 40s.

Hello Tony,
Thanks, I’m looking forward to using it, I’m busy with the house renovation but I’m too thirds through that and will take time off the house to work on the car, I’m hoping a month or so of weekends should see the FJ useable at least for this year. Once I’ve built the garage then move onto upgrades etc, possibly next year......

Regards
Darran

 

[darran1966]

What I forgot to say was before you view any potential swap vehicles measure your engine bay so that you have a three dimensional view of the space available to insert the donor. Historically we've used the bulkhead as the centre point and measured from there so that you know distances to front and rear props, gearbox mount, width at starter, chassis to top of b/h aperture, etc.
Going Toyota to Toyota will be much more straight forward and the great thing about this with a 40 is everything forward of the bulkhead unbolts giving you plenty of work space.

At the end of this month I am passing the village where the BJ73 with the 1KZ-TE is kept. I will try and get photos if you think will help.

Regards,

Rodger

Hello Rodger
That would be most appreciated, any information is helpful.
As you say taking measurements can save a lot of time and money.
Having looked at plenty of pictures via google of different engines and gearboxes one thing I have noticed, more modern gearbox boxes appear to be longer compared to an FJ setup. Time and a tape measure will guide me.
I’d rather not cut the bulkhead or transmission tunnel, but if I have to so be it.
I’m A big fan of neat and tidy engine bays, as the saying goes, the devil is in the detail.

Regards
Darran

 

[darran1966]

Hello,
I took a few more pictures today and had a quick look round and started making a list.
It has the wrong alternator fitted as there is no vac pump or vac pump oil pipes.(I knew this when I bought it) I’m thinking I will upgrade to an alternator with a built in regulator, has anybody any advise on this?
The wiring in general is a mess, under the bonnet and in the cab.
Radiator is weeping, has anyone used the alloy radiators I see advertised?
Looking at the picture showing the injector pump, to the rear of the pump but mounted from the inlet manifold is a solenoid with a shot cable attached to a linkage on the injection pump, I assume this is to raise the engine revs on cold starting, advise on what controls this would be appreciated.
Regards
Darran.
Ps, are the parts from Thailand of good quality, I’m thinking for the weather seals all round

 

[Rodger]

Hi Darran,

I met the guy with the 1KZ-TE and took a few photos but he is going to send me a full set of photos of the install. He mated the engine to the H55F gearbox that the 73 comes with so ha an adapter plate made but you want to have 5 speeds so the gearbox from a 90 series would stay as a complete unit. So more to come....

Looking at your photos I spotted a couple of things, which may help:
Has the front roll bar a sandwich around the floor and extensions to the chassis? I doesn't look like it so it is actually detracting from the strength of the A pillar as it will merely push the floor out as there is no cross member at that point.
You have 60 series axles - handbrake in the rear drums.
The vacuum pipe for the servo is taken off the inlet manifold and the solenoid looks to be an early EDIC unit, which cut the engine when the oil pressure drops below whatever level it is set at. To confirm that - there should be a wire from it to a switch in an oil gallery. It will be behind it.
Looks like you have power steering, although the reservoir is very low down.
No heater and the heater pipes on the engine take the pipe higher than the rad cap so it will be very difficult to bleed the air out - some sort of bleed valve at the top will help the cooling system.
You have a 60 series VR (6 wires) - so you charging system could be working okay - the problem was always mating a the 3 wire 40 series VR to the 60 series alternator. Internal VR alternators are from late 60 series and are very rare. See what comes with the engine you finally opt for.
The rear shocks look like 40 series but are not stretched suggesting the truck has a lift installed. Hangers?
There is a box thing ahead of the axle that I haven't worked out what it is...

Personally I would avoid an ali rad. I have heard some horror stories about them and Mr T's rads work very well and the weight saving makes no difference at all to a 40. My 40 series rad keeps the 60 series engine cool in my truck and it is a lot warmer down here in Spain than the UK.

I don't know about trim from Thailand but it may be worth looking at the trims available from www:woolies-trim.co.uk For the more specialised/specific ones try www:megastore4x4.pt

Regards,

Rodger

 

[darran1966]

Hi Darran,

I met the guy with the 1KZ-TE and took a few photos but he is going to send me a full set of photos of the install. He mated the engine to the H55F gearbox that the 73 comes with so ha an adapter plate made but you want to have 5 speeds so the gearbox from a 90 series would stay as a complete unit. So more to come....

Looking at your photos I spotted a couple of things, which may help:
Has the front roll bar a sandwich around the floor and extensions to the chassis? I doesn't look like it so it is actually detracting from the strength of the A pillar as it will merely push the floor out as there is no cross member at that point.
You have 60 series axles - handbrake in the rear drums.
The vacuum pipe for the servo is taken off the inlet manifold and the solenoid looks to be an early EDIC unit, which cut the engine when the oil pressure drops below whatever level it is set at. To confirm that - there should be a wire from it to a switch in an oil gallery. It will be behind it.
Looks like you have power steering, although the reservoir is very low down.
No heater and the heater pipes on the engine take the pipe higher than the rad cap so it will be very difficult to bleed the air out - some sort of bleed valve at the top will help the cooling system.
You have a 60 series VR (6 wires) - so you charging system could be working okay - the problem was always mating a the 3 wire 40 series VR to the 60 series alternator. Internal VR alternators are from late 60 series and are very rare. See what comes with the engine you finally opt for.
The rear shocks look like 40 series but are not stretched suggesting the truck has a lift installed. Hangers?
There is a box thing ahead of the axle that I haven't worked out what it is...

Personally I would avoid an ali rad. I have heard some horror stories about them and Mr T's rads work very well and the weight saving makes no difference at all to a 40. My 40 series rad keeps the 60 series engine cool in my truck and it is a lot warmer down here in Spain than the UK.

I don't know about trim from Thailand but it may be worth looking at the trims available from www:woolies-trim.co.uk For the more specialised/specific ones try www:megastore4x4.pt

Regards,

Rodger

Hello Rodger
Thanks for your time with regards to the pictures,I look forward to seeing them.
I will check on the roll cage mountings but I think you are correct, no bracing from the cage to the chassis, hopefully the main hoop will be ok as this has the seatbelt mountings attached to it.
I’m sure the brake vacuum pipe only attaches to the inlet in a petrol engine, having said that this engine has a flap in the inlet so it may create enough vacuum when the throttle is closed, most images I see of a BJ under the bonnet and in parts catalogs shows a vacuum pump attached to the alternator.
Time and weather permitting I will strip the brakes this weekend so I can order the correct new ones along with new flexi brake pipes.
Same goes for the fuel injectors and glow plugs.
The whole wiring system has so many splices, bad joints and a mix of colours I may just pull it all out and purchase a new universal kit. I will see how I get on with that.
At present the heater pipe is looped back to the engine, requires connection the the heater matrix
I will hopefully get more pictures over the weekend.....
Regards
Darran.

 

[Rodger]

Hi Darran,

The main roll bar hoop should be seated on the main body cross member - just behind the seats - and from the photos it is in the right place.
Agreed that most of these early diesels have the vacuum pump attached to the back of the alternator.
In my earlier post I said that the rear shocks are 'not' stretched that should have excluded the word 'not'.

Regards,

Rodger

 

[darran1966]

Hi Darran,

The main roll bar hoop should be seated on the main body cross member - just behind the seats - and from the photos it is in the right place.
Agreed that most of these early diesels have the vacuum pump attached to the back of the alternator.
In my earlier post I said that the rear shocks are 'not' stretched that should have excluded the word 'not'.

Regards,

Rodger

Hello Rodger,
I will take pictures of the suspension this weekend, along with the roll cage mountings. I’d appreciate your opinion
Regards
Darran.

 

[Rodger]

Hi Darran,

Apologies for the delay of the photos of Gabriel's BJ73 engine swop. He did say that he did extend the radiator cowl to ensure the air got round the engine and that he mated the H55F gearbox (5spd) to it with an adaptor plate, which he had made by an engineering shop.
If you decide to use this model of engine then he does have a load of photos from the when he did his, which he happen to supply.

Mechanical pump. Throttle bar from an 80

ECU

Hope this helps.
regards,
Rodger

 

[darran1966]

Hello Rodger,
Thank you for the pictures, would I be correct saying that is a 2.4 turbo 4 cylinder... also what vehicles can these be found in from the factory?
Here are some pictures of my suspension, they appear factory and not after market, would you agree? There is some sort of bracket welded to the front of the axle... I see no reason why lol
Radiator removed and sent for overhauling, all brakes stripped off awaiting the new shoes and wheel cylinders, new flexi hoses been made up, still looking for the link wire that goes between the rear brakes shoes, I think it’s part of the self adjuster mechanism.... lots of old and not needed wiring removed, most of roll cage removed,now need to attach the seat belts to the original position.
Still have lots to do but moving in the right direction
Regards
Darran.

 

[Rodger]

Hi Darran,
Gabriel has used the 1KZ-TE from a KZ90/95:2982cc, turbodiesel, inline 4, swirl chamber, electonic fuel injection, 130hp/ 213 ftlbs. (Slightly reduced hp but increased torque from 1996).
But he could have used, assuming he found one, a 1KD-FTV from a KDJ90/95: turbodiesel, inline4, common rail direct injection, 2982cc - 163hp/253ft lbs.
Gabriel wanted to mate his engine to the H55F gearbox but it is far simpler to install the complete engine, box and transfer box as a complete unit. Use the gearbox cross member as the starting point and that will determine the engine mount position.
Certainly the hangers look to be stock so the stretched rear shocks would suggest that they are not the right length - wrong part - and the big bar welded to the axle is not, IMO, necessary. But it doesn't look to sit lower than the base of the diff so it could stay (?). I will photo the mounting on my axle for you. On the 60 series HB cable: the main pull (main cable) goes to the left drum and pulls the shorter cable to the right drum. Adjusted properly they work very well. Be careful with the adjuster bars, they are handed but not marked and if you put them on the wrong wheel then as you use the hand brake it slackens them off. (Don't ask me how I know!). The HB cable should come as a complete unit with both drum ends.
Progress indeed!
Regards,
Rodger

 

[darran1966]

Hello again,
It’s been a while since I was last here however I have been busy over the summer building a garage, it’s nearly finished internally so I will be starting work on the FJ again
So much for a quick fix, register and use.
I’m still undecided on the engine and transmission swap, recently found the BMW m47 or m57 seem popular in certain vehicles as does the VW tdi,
I have overhauled the brakes , started tidying , repairing the wiring, I fitted an Isuzu alternator and vac pump.

 

[SteveJB]

The welded on box section on the axle could this be a jacking point if the diffs are offset would make some sort of sense to stop the vehicle going on the piss especially when loaded tis a thought