Wiring/Starter/12V conversion help

[Michael Clark]

HDJ80 1997

Ok I did the 12v starter conversion. Jumped the timer relay plug. Starter relay clicks but no voltage to the starter solenoid on the starter motor.

So Im trying to trace the starter solenoid wire back to the relay. Am I correct in thinking the black/red wire to the starter motor should have continuity with the black/red wire coming from the starter relay? Or is there something in between

I do have a Toyota dealer fit alarm which could be interfering with it but want to be sure its that before trying anything else.

Is there anything Ive missed? There are two ring terminal wires no not connected to the 24V starter relay which I removed but pretty sure that has nothing to do with it.

Please help!

Cheers

mike

 

[StarCruiser]

Hi Mike, have you connected 12v to the fusible link connected to the + of the LHS battery? AFAIK This feeds into the contacts of the start relay and then on to the starter solenoid.

 

[Chris]

Hmm there's not that many people have done this. But if it started with the 24v system, then if you follow the guide it should start with the conversion. There's no messing to be done with those relays in the picture. It sounds as though it might be something to do with the cluster of fuses and connections on the DS battery. It's that battery that provides the power to the starter solenoid

 

[Chris]

What Rich just said ..

 

[Michael Clark]

Thanks both.

Yes all connected. The relay is putting out 12V to the black/red wire but doesnt seem to be reaching the starter!

Can I download the electrical manuals from somewhere?

 

[Michael Clark]

Ok so the 12v starter wire from the relay is routed into the dash area via IG1 plug to the starter solenoid. Im guessing the alarm intercepts it. Where can I find IG1? behind clocks or near fuse box?

 

[StarCruiser]

It’s LHD but it’s all I have.

Did it work before the conversion? If it did it’s unlikely to be something you didn’t alter.

 

[Michael Clark]

Many thanks for this. Yes was working fine.

Ill take a look in the morning with a fresh head. I always think its something really complicated and usually turns out something simple - something I havent connected etc.

 

[Firewout]

You have a pm

 

[StarCruiser]

Many thanks for this. Yes was working fine.

Ill take a look in the morning with a fresh head. I always think its something really complicated and usually turns out something simple - something I havent connected etc.

You did say you’ve left some wires off…a double check what they do (or did) would be my first port of call.

 

[Michael Clark]

Starcruiser/Rich and Chris. You were right and thanks for tolerating my stupidity.

It works. The fusible link to the LH battery (which I had removed) had dropped down to where the 24V relay had been. I had convinced myself that is where it had been attached, did a couple of checks and ignored it.

This was the offending article. I think as the gauge of the wire was small compared to the wire going into the starter relay I didnt think they were connected. Anyway a continuity test proved otherwise.

Anyway, at least I got a nice electrical manual out of the operation. Thanks Firewout.

Ok back to what Im good at now lol and leave the electrics alone.

 

[StarCruiser]

That’s great Michael. Glad it’s sorted.

I see you have an Intervolt DCC Pro there.

 

[Michael Clark]

Thanks.

And haha yes. Sorry I didnt buy from you, I had a load of stuff shipped over from Oz so bundled it with that package

 

[Chris]

Whoo hoo. Result.

As an aside to this, I have been through a fair number of 24v starters. One in fact caught fire and nearly burned my truck alive up at Frickely 4x4. My theory has always been that the 80 starts so quickly that the starter contacts effectively just arc momentarily leading to quite a bit of burning on the copper contacts. and of course there's some big amps and 24v going through there. I have in fact had the copper side contacts burn right through so that the top hat missed them completely. Whilst in Russia, I had a no start incident which I suspected might have been the battery but given it only takes 10 minutes to drop the starter, I figured I'd take a look inside. Honestly it was like new. No pitting, scorching or any signs of any heat at all after best part of 5 years. it did turn out to be the battery that was pooped. Not sure why but it started gassing terribly. It looks swollen and although appearing OK on test, there's 'summat up wi it'.

OK it may well be fake science but for me it's another log on the bonfire of logical reasons for converting to 12v start.

 

[Michael Clark]

Indeed. I dont think Ive started the truck for 2 months. Ive had the fuel pipes off too. Once I had found the missing connection it started in less than on rotation of the engine.

But thats interesting to note. 24V is a bit overkill really. Not sure why they decided to over engineer it.

BTW, what battery were you using that went dud?

 

[Chris]

I'd have to look Michael. Might be Yuasa or maybe Varta. It has the date written on the top so I know it's exactly 5 years old. It' snot had a good charging regime to be fair. This isn't a daily drive so it can sit for months in the unit. Sometimes it's on a charger but I have effectively 10 batteries up there and I don't have 10 chargers so they all get a bit in rotation. It might be that I had a hard landing at some point an this one suffered physical damage. It was fine to begin with but then started charging at 14volts all the time. I don't think it's the alternator that seems fine. And the other battery is seemingly ok too. Without explaining my charging system in more detail, it's safe to say that it does look like the battery on its way out

 

[frank rabbets]

You raise an interesting subject Chris. I would have thought that the starter contacts are just not big enough. I'm sure they would contact firmly even with engine starting quickly as the core is fired out with some force. I noted when I changed mine that one of the new pair was a lot bigger than the original one fitted. I noted that on the old contacts one had burned away more than the other leading to the top hat contacting at an angle. Perhaps this increases likelihood of jamming.

 

[Chris]

Interesting observation Frank.

 

[StarCruiser]

Mine had burned away on both sides as far as I can recall. It jammed in causing the starter to run on at part speed with only 12v feeding into it.
As with Frank, the kit I got to replace mine was probably twice the size.

The odd thing is, a 12v starter should be taking far more current than an equivalent 24v one. The arc that is established breaking the contact must be more significant on the 24v one. DC arcs are nasty and can be difficult to break as they don’t cross zero like AC ones do.

 

[frank rabbets]

I was thinking about how reliable my 12v starter from Toyota will be Rich. Assuming it's the same wattage the amps must be double. You say that is going to mean less arcing?