Question - Front Hub Removal:

[BobMurphy]

Right Folks, I need some advice before I go and bend something

The Truck - 1998 KZJ95, Manual, 3.0 litre 1KZ-TE motor.

Two new tyres arrived today so, while the front wheels were off I thought I'd remove the rusted-out disk stone guards and fit the nice shiny ones I got from Ian Rubie. I spent a couple of days removing the siezed bolts a few months ago so I know they will be easy to remove once the hubs are out of the way.

So, with the car properly jacked under the chassis rails I removed the front O/S caliper and disk.

Then removed the dust cap.

Then the split pin and retainer.

And then the retaining nut on the end of the drive shaft. I won't go into the hassle of re-fitting a disk and wheel, lowering the car and then using a 34mm socket on a 3/4" power bar to get it off - but it wasn't very tight, 50 ft/lbs at the most, nothing like the 174 ft/lbs in the manual

Next, I thought all I had to do was draw the hub off the shaft and out of the bearing - so . . . .

However, as I hand-tightened the puller the shaft just slid back into the hub. I stopped while I had a few threads left so that I could pull it back out.


From the diagram in the Ellery Manual and from the Toyota parts diagrams there doesn't appear to be anything locking the hub into the bearing. Is this right ??

If so, and assuming I can't use the drive shaft as a fixed point for the hub puller, how does one draw off the hub ??

In the corner of the workshop I have the Grand-Daddy of all slide hammers that I bought for £30 at a Classic Vehicle Autojumble - is that the answer ???

failing that - wooden wedges behind the hub ???

Thoughts please before I go and do something I'll regret (I need the car on Sunday ).

(I could post the diagram from the Ellery manual, but that might be against the rules ).

Yours in anticipation.

Bob.

 

[fridayman]

I'm afraid I can't help, but just wanted to say that I always look fwd to your posts. When I'm not sure if a job might be too big for me, I go and look at some of your posts

 

[BobMurphy]

I'm afraid I can't help, but just wanted to say that I always look fwd to your posts. When I'm not sure if a job might be too big for me, I go and look at some of your posts

You're very kind - but I have to learn too and this is my first Landcruiser.

I don't find the Ellery manual very helpful. In this instance there is a diagram that looks the same as the front end of my car, but then they show a completely different front hub assembly and explain how to strip that

When I post stuff its usually after I've done a lot of research and have successfully taken something apart and put it all back together again

I have some heavy-duty tools and know to my cost not to rush into anything

Once this job is done I'll complete the picture sequence.

Bob.

 

[Andrew Prince]

Bob,
I've never stripped the front hub of an IFS 4wd vehicle, so have no firsthand experience to pass on here BUT an observation... In your last pic, there appears to be some rust sitting between the hub and the "spindle". I wonder whether a spray with some penetrating oil and a few modest taps with your grand-daddy slide hammer might be all it needs

In other words, I guess I'm asking how much force you were actually able to apply with your puller on your first attempt and it might be a case of a smidgen more force breaking the friction and the hub comes off

Cheers,

 

[Nuclear Chicken]

Bob

Looks fairly similar to the 120 when I did mine during the summer. I'll give you a call tonight when I get in and we'll see. If you can refer to my post it might help in the interim.

 

[BobMurphy]

In other words, I guess I'm asking how much force you were actually able to apply with your puller on your first attempt and it might be a case of a smidgen more force breaking the friction and the hub comes off

Cheers,

Hi,

No force at all - the driveshaft just slides back out of sight, which surprised me as I thought it was a rigid part of the CV Joint on the inside of the steering knuckle. The parts diagrams just show the driveshaft assembly as a single unit, not the individual components, so I'm working blind.

From the diagram it looks as though the drive shaft nut pulls the CV Joint and Hub together, sandwiching the bearing that is held in the steering knuckle by a snap ring. I can't see anything else holding the hub on (but I might be wrong).

The Parts Diagrams show this:

I'm probably being over-cautious and a good whack will shift it - but I've damaged things before by making assumptions and don't want to damage anything just for the sake of a rotten stone guard (that I can live with a bit longer while I find out the truth).

Bob.

 

[BobMurphy]

Bob

Looks fairly similar to the 120 when I did mine during the summer. I'll give you a call tonight when I get in and we'll see. If you can refer to my post it might help in the interim.

Hi again,

I've got your previous posts and the Parts Diagrams for the 120-Series, thanks.

I was expecting the hub to pull straight off - and it probably does - I just wanted confirmation before I started using more force on it.

Thanks.

Bob.

 

[Jon Wildsmith]

The drive shaft has a plunge joint which lets it change length and so that's all you're pushing out the back of the hub. If you look round the back of the hub you should be able to push it in & out? When it's fully collapsed you should be able to put some bar down the hole and use your puller against that.

 

[BobMurphy]

Thanks Jon,

I didn't want to put a lot of force on the shaft and diff, but if that is the accepted method I'll give it a go.

I tried putting a large steel tree-felling wedge between the back of a wheel stud and one of the bolts holding the stone guard - then I used a 2.5lb club hammer on it (I didn't 'welly' it).

No movement, so I guess this is going to take some force.

I'll use a larger puller than that shown in my photo

Bob.

 

[Jon Wildsmith]

I haven't take a 90 series hub apart Bob, there could be other things holding the hub on I just know the drive shafts have plunge joints because they have to be able to change length Looking at the pictures I'm struggling to believe that little nut is all that holds you hub on

 

[BobMurphy]

Looking at the pictures I'm struggling to believe that little nut is all that holds you hub on

Yes, that's been bothering me too, but there doesn't seem to be anything else that could be holding it. That 'little nut' is 34mm diameter and should be torqued to 174 ft/lbs though.

I did as you suggested and used a bigger puller. The drive shaft was pushed back and I gave it some force with a 17mm spanner. I wasn't happy with the concept though as the force must be on the tripod joint bearings at the diff end of the drive shaft. It just doesn't feel like an acceptable engineering solution.

I guess I didn't try it with much conviction as I was sure I was about to damage the driveshaft, so I didn't pursue it.

I'm not around tomorrow and on Thursday I'm going to put it all back together while I do some more research.

Thanks for your input.

Bob.

 

[Steve H]

Hi, Bob. You will find that the hub is a press fit into the wheel bearing. You will need to break the upper and lower swivel joints and then press out the hub from the rear. From memory, I dont think there are any circlips or the like holding the hub in but there is a circlip holding in the one piece bearing. I replaced my front wheel bearing about 10 months ago and had to use a press to get it out. The drive shaft nut only holds in the shaft itself and loads the bearing. Sorry but I dont have any photos of the removal process but hope this helps.

 

[BobMurphy]

Steve,

Many thanks, I was thinking it had to be something like that as there isn't a lot holding it all together.

That seems like a lot of work just to replace the stone guards so I'll give it a miss right now and plan to replace the upper and lower wishbone bushes at a later date.

Everything on my truck is rusted so it might take some time to fix.

(A couple og years ago my local tool shop had a 50 ton floor-standing press on offer at £999.00. I thought long and hard but couldn't justify the cost. Now I wish I had just gone and done it ).

Bob.

 

[Wayne Andrews]

Hi Bob you know there is a quick way to fit that shield......
As long as you can remove the retaining bolts you can obviously cut off the old one, then if you cut the new one straight through to the centre preferably on the shortest piece of metal and between two mounting bolts. Then pull shield slightly apart and turn the shield over the hub flange like a thread. you could even weld it back together or even a couple of tac welds, I know you're pretty handy with the welder. It would save a lot of heart ache.

 

[BobMurphy]

Hi Bob you know there is a quick way to fit that shield......

Hi,

Yes, I had thought about cutting the new shields, but so far have decided that I really should take the whole, rusted, assembly apart and give it a good clean and check-over.

One member found that he needed 25 tons to get the hub to move in the knuckle arm and about 2 to 3 tons once it was moving. I have found a 50-ton press on-line for around £600 (a much cheaper-looking one was £450) which is a lot better than £1,800 from Machine Mart and so-on.

This of course does not go down well at home.

However, spending £1,200 on a Vet's Bill for a horse that is too old to do anything useful is perfectly acceptable

I spent a couple of days with a propane torch getting the shield bolts undone (one had to be drilled out and the thread re-cut) and the old shields are now held on with greased stainless bolts, so no problems there.

I may yet take up your suggestion.

Bob.

 

[Steve H]

Bob
A cheaper option would be to take off the swivel arms and take them to a local machine shop and ask them to press them out for you. Probably against the grain with you but at least the job would be done without all the aggro.

Steve

 

[BobMurphy]

Bob
A cheaper option would be to take off the swivel arms and take them to a local machine shop and ask them to press them out for you. Steve

Yes, that is an option, though my local Machine Shop closed a couple of years ago. They only had a 25 ton press which might have been a bit light for this. They struggled to press the torsion bars out of some Rubery-Owen suspension arms when I was restoring a trailer a good few years ago.

Another place that has done work for me has a 15 ton press - definitely a no-no.

There will be others about, but I do like to do things myself. I could have used a decent press many times over the years and this is just an excuse to acquire one

Taking a calculated view . . £600 for the press is 4.5% of what the LC has cost me over the last two years - and I'll still have it as an asset

Bob.