auto gearbox

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Morning. Can anyone tell me why my automatic gearbox oil temp light comes on when I'm towing? well, I know why it comes on, because the oil is too hot, but why?
I've only had the vehicle (1991 HDJ80 1HD-T) for about 2 months. And when I first got it I changed the auto oil and cleaned the filter as it was not changing gear quite right, the oil in the box was very old and dirty. Anyway, new oil in and it changes gear a lot better now. But, when I'm towing something heavy (like 2 or 3 tonnes) the AT oil temp light comes on, if I slow down to about 20-30 mph it goes out. I've not had the time to look, but there must be a separate auto box oil cooler, and I guess this'll be the problem. Or it could be the auto box pump not pumping fast enough. Or.... Any ideas?
Cheers,
Matt Savage in Derbyshire, still could but no chance of snow
 
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Matt
Are you a member of the 80scool list (http://www.lcool.org)? This is international and, more to the point for you, includes the USA where they have a lot of experience of auto transmission problems. It might be worth posting the question there.
Christopher Bell
Devon, UK
>
>
Morning. Can anyone tell me why my automatic gearbox oil temp light comes on when I'm towing? well, I know why it comes on, because the oil is too hot, but wh
I've only had the vehicle (1991 HDJ80 1HD-T) for about 2 months. And when I first got it I changed the auto oil and cleaned the filter as it was not changing gear quite right, the oil in the box was very old and dirty. Anyway, new oil in and it changes gear a lot better now. But, when I'm towing something heavy (like 2 or 3 tonnes) the AT oil temp light comes on, if I slow down to about 20-30 mph it goes out. I've not had the time to look, but there must be a separate auto box oil cooler, and
 
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Dear Gareth,
Thanks for the info.
Cheers,
Matt
----- Original Message -----
From: Gareth Jones
To: [Email address removed]
Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2005 9:31 AM
Subject: Re: [ELCO] auto gearbox
Matt, I suggest you have a good read of
http://www.automatictransmission.com.au/
The owner Rodney, is a well respected L/C authority on autos. He has
lots of tips and improvements for gearboxes. Suggest also that you
register and search the Birfield archives there have been lots of
threads on these subjects.
www.Birfield
The address below is also a good technical resource.
http://www.sleeoffroad.com/
Happy hunting
Gareth Jones '97 1-HDFT Manual
--
European Land Cruiser Owners Mailing List
Further Info: http://www.landcruisers.info/lists/
 
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Hi Christopher,
I tried to join but never received an e-mail. I e-mailed the guy and he said he'd look into it......
Cheers,
Matt
----- Original Message -----
From: Christopher Bell
To: [Email address removed]
Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2005 9:46 AM
Subject: Re: [ELCO] auto gearbox
Matt
Are you a member of the 80scool list (http://www.lcool.org)? This is international and, more to the point for you, includes the USA where they have a lot of experience of auto transmission problems. It might be worth posting the question there.
Christopher Bell
Devon, UK


Morning. Can anyone tell me why my automatic gearbox oil temp light comes on when I'm towing? well, I know why it comes on, because the oil is too hot, but why?
I've only had the vehicle (1991 HDJ80 1HD-T) for about 2 months. And when I first got it I changed the auto oil and cleaned the filter as it was not changing gear quite right, the oil in the box was very old and dirty. Anyway, new oil in and it changes gear a lot better now. But, when I'm towing something heavy (like 2 or 3 tonnes) the AT oil temp light comes on, if I slow down to about 20-30 mph it goes out. I've not had the time to look, but there must be a separate auto box oil cooler, and I guess this'll be the problem. Or it could be the auto box pump not pumping fast enough. Or.... Any ideas? Cheers,Matt Savage in Derbyshire, still could but no chance of snow
 
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Hi Matt,
There is a small oil cooler stuck on the bottom of the main radiator,
however the toyo autobox is quite notorious for running hot.
If you are going to be doing a fair amount of towing or motorway work,
you are strongly advised to add an extra cooler.
As Gareth has pointed out automatic transmissions in Aus are the 'world
experts' and they do an oil cooler kit for the 80, although you should
probably be able to cobble something together yourself.
If it is overheating, I guess it could possibly be down to internal
wear.
When you did the oil change, did you do the full flush? There is a
technique for flushing the whole system whilst running - you use more
oil, but it does a good job of cleaning things out.
--
Regards,
Julian Voelcker
Mobile: 07971 540362
Cirencester, United Kingdom
1994 HDJ80, 2.5" OME Lift, ARB
 
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Matt,
Regardless of the current issue with gearbox cooling, you still have
an option to fit a larger A/T oil cooler (it comes as standard in the
M East version).
At the moment you have only a small cooler on the left hand side of
the engine block (have you checked it?)
Last time I spoke to AAI, a S/H cooler including brackets was Euro
125,- Hoses and the double pipe that goes thru the headlamp support
plate was about Euro 34 (actually I have one spare support plate if
someone's interested) The stuff had to be ordered from Japan and it
took about four weeks to be delivered.
--
Rgds,
Roman (London, UK)
'92 HDJ80
 
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Hi Julian
Whats the technique for better flushing the gear box,
what should you do if the gear box heats up and the light comes on,
what do you mean about a lot of motor way driving,
i havent seen this light yahoo but where is it,
should the toy garage know about this better flushing and would they do it
automaticall or would you have to ask them and them how would you know if
they did it, more oil used , how much more,
would using the synthetic oil work better for the temp.
thanks
John c
92HDJ 80 1HD-T Auto Ireland
 
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Full flush!? We're not talking toilet talk here are we?!!
anyway, no. I just drained the oil out, cleaned the filter pan with petrol and put it all back together and filled it up.
What the fancy flush method?
Cheers,
Matt
----- Original Message -----
From: Julian Voelcker
To: [Email address removed]
Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2005 9:58 AM
Subject: Re: [ELCO] auto gearbox
Hi Matt,
> I've not had the time to look, but there must be a separate auto box
> oil cooler, and I guess this'll be the problem.
There is a small oil cooler stuck on the bottom of the main radiator,
however the toyo autobox is quite notorious for running hot.
If you are going to be doing a fair amount of towing or motorway work, you are strongly advised to add an extra cooler.
As Gareth has pointed out automatic transmissions in Aus are the 'world
experts' and they do an oil cooler kit for the 80, although you should probably be able to cobble something together yourself.
If it is overheating, I guess it could possibly be down to internal
wear.
When you did the oil change, did you do the full flush? There is a
technique for flushing the whole system whilst running - you use more
oil, but it does a good job of cleaning things out.
--
Regards,
Julian Voelcker
Mobile: 07971 540362
Cirencester, United Kingdom
1994 HDJ80, 2.5" OME Lift, ARB
--
European Land Cruiser Owners Mailing List
Further Info: http://www.landcruisers.info/lists/
 
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Guest

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Hi Matt,
There is a technique where you disconnect the pipes on the gearbox side
of the oil cooler, attach an extension to the oil cooler put it into a
waste drum and then put the other pipe into a clean oil supply - you
basically run the engine and let the auto box pump the oil through
until you get clear oil coming out into the waste drum - you do end up
using about 50% more oil, but you do get more crap out, a lot more than
just draining when hot.
I will try to dig out the exact details of which pipes to disconnect,
etc.
--
Regards,
Julian Voelcker
Mobile: 07971 540362
Cirencester, United Kingdom
1994 HDJ80, 2.5" OME Lift, ARB
 
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Guest

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Hi John,
Questions, questions, questions.
See what I posted to Matt.
Either stop (but keep engine running in Park) or slow down until the light
goes back off - it really depends on what is causing the problem - I ended up
with a burnt out autobox which cost ?2200 to rebuild so always err on the
side of caution.
If I had it now, I would limp home and then flush the box - the problem could
be anything, but since the oil is the life blood of the box and controls most
of what goes on it is always the best place to start.
Basically any heavy use of the gearbox, whether that is doing 90-100MPH every
day down the motorway, cresting dunes in the Sahara or towing horse boxes.
Should be on the dash - look in your manual - it is just to the right of the
ABS light on mine.
A note to you and Matt - if you do get a problem it is well worth checking
the Self Diagnostic mode of the box - a Haynes manual or factory manual might
be useful here - I have used the Haynes for this in the past.
The heat is most likely a symptom of some other problem - check the self
diagnosis to see if that hints at something.
I doubt it.
I suspect that you will have to ask them, although cheaper to go to local
mechanic, it will be a lot cheaper. Expect to use up to 50% more.
Yes, because they tend to run cleaner. If converting, I would be inclined to
change the oil quite soon after the initial change (after about a 1000 miles)
to clear any crap that the synth oil has loosened.
The big warning with synth oil is that it effects the seals slightly and will
find a way through weak seals that old dyno oil wouldn't get through. So
keep an eye on your driveway/garage floor after the initial couple of
changes.
--
Regards,
Julian Voelcker
Mobile: 07971 540362
Cirencester, United Kingdom
1994 HDJ80, 2.5" OME Lift, ARB
 
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ah-ha! That makes sense. I might try that, and, as roman said, look at getting an additional oil cooler.
Cheers,
Matt
----- Original Message -----
From: Julian Voelcker
To: [Email address removed]
Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2005 11:04 AM
Subject: Re: [ELCO] auto gearbox
Hi Matt,
> Full flush!? We're not talking toilet talk here are we?!!
There is a technique where you disconnect the pipes on the gearbox side
of the oil cooler, attach an extension to the oil cooler put it into a waste drum and then put the other pipe into a clean oil supply - you
basically run the engine and let the auto box pump the oil through
until you get clear oil coming out into the waste drum - you do end up using about 50% more oil, but you do get more crap out, a lot more than
just draining when hot.
I will try to dig out the exact details of which pipes to disconnect,
etc.
--
Regards,
 
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Guest

Guest
Julian
Personally, I didn't have any issues with a hot gearbox cresting those dunes in the Sahara....I'd do it again any day of the week, and in preference to UK driving at 70 (UK) -120 (EU) mph on motorways/autobahns whatever.
I did keep checking every day but I guess having a complete flush out before, then a complete refill of autogearbox fluid before I left the UK, this ensured there were no overheat problems.
(My two pennies worth [or is that sixpence...])
I don't even know what the symbol is on the dash for an overheated gearbox on my cruiser....
Renate
>>> [Email address removed] 01/26/05 11:21am >>>
Hi John,
Questions, questions, questions.
> Whats the technique for better flushing the gear box,
See what I posted to Matt.
> what should you do if the gear box heats up and the light comes on
Either stop (but keep engine running in Park) or slow down until the light
goes back off - it really depends on what is causing the problem - I ended up
with a burnt out autobox which cost =A32200 to rebuild so always err on the
side of caution.
If I had it now, I would limp home and then flush the box - the problem could
be anything, but since the oil is the life blood of the box and controls most
of what goes on it is always the best place to start.
> what do you mean about a lot of motor way driving
Basically any heavy use of the gearbox, whether that is doing 90-100MPH every
day down the motorway, cresting dunes in the Sahara or towing horse boxes.
> i havent seen this light yahoo but where is it,
Should be on the dash - look in your manual - it is just to the right of the
ABS light on mine.
A note to you and Matt - if you do get a problem it is well worth checking
the Self Diagnostic mode of the box - a Haynes manual or factory manual might
be useful here - I have used the Haynes for this in the past.
The heat is most likely a symptom of some other problem - check the self
diagnosis to see if that hints at something.
> should the toy garage know about this better flushing and would they do it
> automaticall
I doubt it.
> Or would you have to ask them and them how would you know if
> they did it, more oil used , how much more,
I suspect that you will have to ask them, although cheaper to go to local
mechanic, it will be a lot cheaper. Expect to use up to 50% more.
> Would using the synthetic oil work better for the temp.
Yes, because they tend to run cleaner. If converting, I would be inclined to
change the oil quite soon after the initial change (after about a 1000 miles)
to clear any crap that the synth oil has loosened.
The big warning with synth oil is that it effects the seals slightly and will
find a way through weak seals that old dyno oil wouldn't get through. So
keep an eye on your driveway/garage floor after the initial couple of
changes.
--
Regards,
Julian Voelcker
Mobile: 07971 540362
Cirencester, United Kingdom
1994 HDJ80, 2.5" OME Lift, ARB
 
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Elco
Sorry guys but I like my auto and wouldn't have any thing else...
unless it was given and then if it were manual 'd try and sell it...
Renate
 
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regarding the auto vx (oops!) vs manual debate (did ya get it?)
my mechanic wasnt sure why people opted for autos, could someone advise on why
this would be?
only answer i could give was that its a doddle to drive and dont have to think
about changing gear (the main reasons for auto)
but other than that i couldnt answer.
dyf
Quoting Renate Haupt <[Email address removed]>:
--
 
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I think the auto/manual 'thing' could run and run. It is all down to
personal preference and mine is for auto. The Toyota auto boxes are as tough
as brick you-know-whats, its wise to fit an oil cooler to them if you
envisage heavy work, ie towing, or going to hot countries, and they can cope
with anything you care to throw at them. And then back here in congested
blighty, there is no frantic pumping up and down of the left foot. In Kenya
where I was born and spent half my life, we had a manual TLC, used a lot in
mud and dry stuff. Since then, I've used exclusively auto in every car I've
had since the age of 25 and have been more than happy. I also think that in
sand and dunes etc the characteristics of an auto box are much better suited
to these sort of conditions, with the slower release of torque in H2 and H3
and the ability to feed the power in on throttle alone. It can get pretty
hectic in the driving seat with a manual, with one hand on the wheel, one
changing gear, one foot dabbing throttle and brake and the other pumping the
clutch. I prefer two hands on the wheel where poss in sand particularly on
descents, as one smal wrong turn of the wheel can mean a quick and dangerous
roll. And then a lengthy and tiring recovery.
I think you have to think how you are going to use the car and consequently
how big you want your left thigh to become. I never say never but I doubt
whether I will go back to manual again. Its horses for courses and I'm happy
with my set up.
Jeremy
Jeremy Llewellyn-jones
--
 
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Dyf, it is purely a matter of personal preference. We have two "camps"
here - the "stick shifters" and the "torque converters". Each group is
convinced they have the best product and some members of the groups will
expand wonderful theories to back up their preferences.
Personally I don't think there is a bona fide technical arguement
either way. Each method of power transmission has its inherent strengths
and weaknesses.
With regard to Toyota gearboxes per se, you will find a lot of info on
the auto boxes in the Birfield archives - did you take my advice and
have a look here ? Be aware that 80's have had various upgrades to the
auto boxes over the years. Familiarise yourself with the model numbers
and the years that they were fiited in Cruisers.
Having said that unless a previous owner has abused the gearbox or
never bothered having the oil changed it is unlilkely you will get
problems with them.
When searching the archives you would be well advised to pay attention
to any posts from - Rodney King of - I think - Wholesale Automatics or
Wholesale Transmissions in Australia. He has a wealth of experience and
upgrades on the autos. Regard him as a Guru !!
Drive a few autos and a few manuals. Pick the system you prefer and
don't pay any attention whatsoever to the "opposing camp". At the end of
the day it is your money not theirs.
Gareth Jones. Newport S.Wales.
 
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hi gareth
ive only ever driven an auto once in my life and that was for a mile, test
driving a rangie.
will soon see if i like it i suppose (before i commit the money!)
birfield.com you referring to? yeh im on there now having a butchers.
d
Quoting Gareth Jones <[Email address removed]>:
--
 
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Dyf, with regard to RR auto boxes and a comparision with Toyota
Transmissions - the 3 speed Chrysler box in the early classic RR was a
bullet proof box - we used to use it in comp safari racers. The downside
for a road vehicle was just 3 gears. The ZF 4 speed box is more relaxed,
than the Chrsysler, at motorway speeds but is no way as tough as the
Toyota box, plus the Toyota transfer box is better made.
QUESTION TO ALL --- Does the Toyota T/B use a chain or a series of
gears like the old L / R - LT 230 transfer box ??????????????
Good luck,
Gareth Jones.
 
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Almost certain it is a series of gears.
Jeremy Llewellyn-Jones
Mob: 07831 458 793
--
 
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