Health and Safety, who needs it?.....Lol!

[Towpack]

 

[Chris]

Well basically the many who fell off and died ...

I bet they were ready for their tea when they got home. I do wonder how may people were killed by falling spanners.

 

[Towpack]

According to official records only 5 workers died during construction of the Empire State Building, which would be considered unacceptable by today’s standards but is a pretty good record IMO considering the work practices of the time and the number of workers involved. It was completed in 13 months!
I’ll wager that would be impossible today even with modern equipment and construction methods.

 

[joinerman]

Bugger me Towpack i was only watching that video a few nights ago.

 

[Towpack]

Well, still on the H&S front, I fell foul of the regs today, sort of. Popped in to a well known DIY store for some 32mm plastic waste pipe. I needed just under 2m but they only had it in around 4m lengths but no problem, it was cheap enough. So I asked in store "would you mind cutting this in half so I can get it in the car please?"

"Sorry Sir, we're not allowed to used saws, H&S"

"OK, can I borrow one to cut it in half please?"

"Sorry Sir, we can't lend you a saw in case you injure yourself, H&S but if you want to buy a saw and cut in down yourself in the car park that's OK"

No way was I buying another saw having several at home so, reluctantly went to a rival store close by which I like to avoid for reasons past and voila! They have it in shorter lengths. Sorted .
Now I'm certainly not against rules and regs aimed at personal safety, we live and breath them at work and no doubt if I was to sever my Femural Artery and bleed out in the plumbing section there'd be reams of paperwork but, joking aside, its getting a bit daft now.
Don't know what this country is coming to.

 

[Shayne]

I'm guessing it was in the 70's and i doubt it was nearly as high in Ireland but my old man said he quit the steel erecting job though he loved it when it got to feeling like someone fell to their death weekly and it was only a matter of time before he followed them down the quick way .

 

[chadr]

The potential to be sued may also play a part - if they lent a customer a saw and they ended up injuring themselves, the ambulance chasers would come crawling out of the woodwork and end up suing the DIY store for a gazillion quid!!

 

[Chas]

I'm guessing it was in the 70's and i doubt it was nearly as high in Ireland but my old man said he quit the steel erecting job though he loved it when it got to feeling like someone fell to their death weekly and it was only a matter of time before he followed them down the quick way .

When I was an apprentice sparks I worked for a firm that installed floodlighting for sports grounds, we had an electrician who for a laugh would rock the towers, you can imagine the effect about 80ft up in the air, I refused to work with him , I think he was eventually sacked because no one wanted to work with him.

 

[Shayne]

My local B&Q manager is obviously a wise man he leaves saws "for sale" in the more industrial bare concrete floor section where 3x2 woods , paving slabs , sewer piping etc is stored under a sign that says do not cut wood yourself and evidently staff are told to avoid that section

Ways and means , rules are for people who can't think for themselves .

 

[Shayne]

When I was an apprentice sparks I worked for a firm that installed floodlighting for sports grounds, we had an electrician who for a laugh would rock the towers, you can imagine the effect about 80ft up in the air, I refused to work with him , I think he was eventually sacked because no one wanted to work with him.

The safety elf shut down the site on us just because he caught us dragging erected lug and pin scaffold from one place to the next with a digger and climbing up it again to save time taking it down and putting it up again when i worked on the demolition , he had a point i suppose

The Isle of Man was slow to adopt much of it though , the demo boss got around the fact we had no personal safety equipment at all by putting a note in our wage packets saying it is available and failure to use/wear it is our own responsibility , or something like that , it was enough to rid us of the elf invasions for a while anyway

 

[Chris]

I really shouldn't, but I do like to educate. You see this isn't H&S at all. It's not. It's a shit interpretation of what people think H&S says. There is no regulation anywhere in the UK that would prevent this. OK using a power saw must be done by a competent person of course. But outside of that, this is all local or company ruling. H&S does not concern itself with civil law. You can't sue under the 74 Act - it's a criminal act not civil law. That is as has been pointed out, some misguided view of liability. You lend me a saw and it's defective and it fails and I am injured, actually I might have a case. But on balance how many people get injured by saws that fail? If I buy the saw, go outside and it fails, I still have a case under the sale of goods and product liability.

It's partly why after 30 years as a safety professional, I have left the profession.

 

[frank rabbets]

There's health and safety, that's one thing, but on top of this you have negligence and public liability. The latter is what people can sue on.
I worked on a farm when I left school. One of my first jobs was to take the asbestos sheet roof off a barn. I was given a ladder and a crowbar. I manage to complete the job without falling through on to the concrete floor.
Those spanners in the video are ace. The pointed end is to wedge in the beam holes to line them up before you can slip a bolt in to an adjoining hole(s).

 

[Chas]

Those spanners in the video are ace. The pointed end is to wedge in the beam holes to line them up before you can slip a bolt in to an adjoining hole(s).

I used a much smaller version in the theatre rigging lighting bars, it had a ratchet head with a different size head either side, I still have mine, in the garage . . . . . . somewhere?

 

[Shayne]

You see this isn't H&S at all. It's not. It's a shit interpretation of what people think H&S says

Aye driven by America's compensation culture and the saddest part is there is no need for it here because our legal system demands reason .

So you burned your mouth eating a hot apple pie - did you not know hot food burns - get out .

Worst still though it promotes a culture of absolute denial , of victim blaming . We made a mistake we are sorry and we would like to make amends is a response forbidden by a board of directors nobody ever sees .

Globalization , the concentration of wealth , the degradation of democracy , the growing divide , open borders , the inevitable advance of global unity , comes at a cost all factual calculations deny because they are oblivious to them .

A culture where common decency is likely to make you liable , where right and wrong are replaced with legal or not legal and the interpretation of that depends on how wealthy you are . And of course one persons legal right might be greater than the next persons because they are somehow different . Unity without community making personal reputations worthless . A dog eats dog world and they call it progress .

So many reasons why some of us hanker for the so called dark ages when kids used to go out to play and if you ran out of milk at an inconvenient time you would just borrow some from your next door neighbour until the shop opens . And no factual evidence that any of it is true .

 

[Higgy]

Over the years iv had to get my chainsaw ticket/Fork lift/Telehandler/Harness safety and use ticket/ The list is endless. But anyone can go into BnQ and buy a chainsaw or any equipment that can Kill Instantly.. Or even go down to your Local Manitou Dealer and as long as you got a driving License ... Drive off with one... Or buy a 300HP John Deer Tractor off ebay and go and cause carnage on your way back home.... Seems Nuts..And when i worked down the Coal mines, the only reason we wore Hard Hats was we needed somewhere to hang our Lamps...

 

[flint]

My late dad was an HM Factory Inspector from just after WW2 until he retired. A part of his work was investigating accidents and prosecuting employers who blatantly put those who worked for them at risk. A lot of it though was advisory, the types of guards needed on machinery, safe materials handling, etc. etc.. Nothing spoils your day like losing a limb, brain damage or dying.
A bit dry, but worth a look: https://www.hse.gov.uk/myth/myth-busting/index.htm

 

[Chris]

That pointy bar for lining up holes is called a podger btw.

 

[Higgy]

Down't Pit they were Called Rat Tails... For lining up the holes for the fish plates when we were setting the Tunnel Rings, Just about every one on the Coal face had one Hanging off their belt..And if you lost yours No one would ever lend you theirs.... Rat tail one end and 24mm the other

 

[goodoldboy]

The last job I worked P.A.Y.E. the safety rep was always yakin on about gloves & glasses.when I pointed out the unguarded 3.70 M drop next to our job she said it was the main contractors responsibility.It's mostly about covering arses in Spain - but not ours

 

[Chas]

That pointy bar for lining up holes is called a podger btw.

Thanks Chris, I knew there was a name but couldn't remember it.