little, tiny, item needed

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Hi Guys
Just thought I would bore you on a nice Saturday afternoon, and share the
lessons learned by me.
Decided to go on an off road day today to a training circuit, about 2 and
1/2 miles long per lap.
Does anyone have an A.R.B front bumper for the 80 series cruiser that they
will sell to me, or know where I can pick one up second hand.
I ask because I now need a new front bumper for the cruiser, after coming
down too hard on the front at a big dip.
Also if a stone (maybe is stuck in the caliper/brake) I have a scretching
noise when driving and a grinding noise when brakes applied,
will it fall out itself,
need to be taken out and if so how.
Great fun and really interesting and as I have been told a couple of
hundred times by some of you, there is no experience like the practical
experience.
Well says me, again you lot have been proved right.
I now know my ATs are not much use when it comes to grip in heavy mud and
really not any good when you need grip on mud at an angle praying you wont
drop off the edge.
Your heart will start again in succession over and over again after stopping
with fright and stress.
I thought I knew things and I did but not enough by far.
The auto box is good for climbing slippy hills but lacks the engine stopping
power coming down and tends to let you move just a little too fast even in
the low and L.
The overhang at the front and rear can be a problem and now I know why A.R.B
and others do such good bussiness.
The plastic corners on the bumpers dont stand up to much and the front
bumper is not too strong either.
Now Julian dont throw me out in the cold but a well equiped LR is much
better than an ill equiped Cruiser.
I felt like Custard at the battle of the little big horn, exept there were
no indians only LRs all around.
Its amazing the angle at which a cruiser will stay upright even when the
driver is hanging on for his dear life at an angle.
My hair is now whiter than what it was this morning.
cheers
john 92HDJ 80 1HDT Rep of Ireland
 
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JB wrote...
Just thought I would bore you on a nice Saturday afternoon, and share the
lessons learned by me.
SNIP
Hey JB, its quiet here at the weekends usually, so you won't get many
responses. You'll just have to put up with me ;-)
Then wrote...
Decided to go on an off road day today to a training circuit, about 2 and
1/2 miles long per lap.
Does anyone have an A.R.B front bumper for the 80 series cruiser that they
will sell to me, or know where I can pick one up second hand.
SNIP
I am pleased that you are getting ready for your Plain trip, it shows
you are being conscientious, congratulations. Sorry don't know about
bumpers but I thought you lived on Ebay ?
Then wrote...
Also if a stone (maybe is stuck in the caliper/brake) I have a scretching
noise when driving and a grinding noise when brakes applied,
will it fall out itself, need to be taken out and if so how.
SNIP
If you are lucky the screeching is one of the wear indicators, which
means you have worn pads. otherwise you can have a stone in there,
they can even get into the groove that is cut across the pad from top
to bottom across the narrow dimension. They don't usually fall out.
All this inspection process should be in the manual you have to hand
anyway, but in case.......
To remove them, work on one wheel at a time, lock all the car doors
and keep any kids or dogs - and yourself - out of the cabin for the
duration of the whole process.
Slacken the wheel nuts:
jack up:
put an axle stand under the axle and lower the axle onto it:
push and pull on the raised wheel to check the stand is stable:
remove the nuts and wheel:
look at the caliper and you will see two steel pad securing pins
going through and across the caliper/pad assembly that are about 5mm
thick, they will be secured by some form of safety pin through one
end either outside or inside the caliper fame:
remove the safety pin and then drive out the pad securing pins with a
thin punch:
grip the edge of the pad's steel backing plate with a 'Mole' type
locking plier and then wiggle each pad out keeping an eye open for
any anti-squeal shims that are also in there:
you may even find a stone between a steel backing for the pad and the
disc and not just the friction surface and disc:
carefully clean out the void either side of the disc, particularly
looking for crud at the extremities of the slot where the edges of
the pad backing plates go (Don't use water or any pressure jet of
fluid or air. Best if you can get a can of brake cleaner. But
whatever you use to soften the crud also use a toothbrush and a thin
piece of wood to scrape the muck out), and have a look at the rubber
shrouds round the caliper pistons - in-situ - and make sure they are
not cracked etc:
re-assemble with copper rich brake grease - the pins, backs of the
pads and shims, and the outer edges of the steel backing pads:
at this stage do not be tempted to press the pistons back into the caliper:
put the pads and any shims back in place, which should be easier than
the process of getting them out:
replace the locating pins and their safety pins:
re-assemble the rest in the reverse order etc.
At no time during the whole process should the brake pedal be
depressed, only do it when you are sure all parts are re-assembled -
hence locking the doors.
When you have done at least one pair on one axle (don't just do one
caliper), start the engine and operate the brake pedal a few times
before even moving. If you did notice that a piston shroud was split
or perished, get a new seal kit from Milner (cheap) and then get back
to us about the next stage OK?
And then again wrote...
I now know my ATs are not much use when it comes to grip in heavy mud and
really not any good when you need grip on mud at an angle praying you wont
drop off the edge. Your heart will start again in succession over and
over again after stopping
with fright and stress.
SNIP
You are getting there JB. This is why I will not subscribe to the
'Trac Edge' type of tyre, they have good forward push but the
sideways grip is not so good. Its only when you are slipping sideways
on a narrow mountain track that you realise the value of these minor points !
Followed by...
The auto box is good for climbing slippy hills but lacks the engine stopping
power coming down and tends to let you move just a little too fast even in
the low and L.
SNIP
Good man, you are observant. This is just why old Luddites like me
don't like auto boxes (other listers too), you should try it in
packed snow going downhill with an autobox !!
Finally writing...
Now Julian dont throw me out in the cold but a well equiped LR is much
better than an ill equiped Cruiser.
SNIP
Re-write that one JB. A well equipped TLC is better than any other
ill-equipped 4X4. Don't feel inferior just cos a tricked-up 90 went
over the course better than you. And remember, the best equipment you
have is the driver. Good experience counts for a lot, and often
overcomes any deficiency in bolt-ons. Keep getting the experience and
you will get what I mean. (When I went on the Plain with my little
old SWB Pajero with road biased tyres, I managed to keep going
without a tow when others with lifted suspensions and big knobbly
tyres were getting bogged and even sump grounded. But I had been
drive the rough stuff every week, and the others just do it for fun
once a month.) You just keep on building-up that experience. Well done.
Any problem doing the work on Sunday, give me a call on the number I
have given you previously - it will get through to me.
Cheers
Jon
'92 HZJ80 ex UN Bosnia surplus
 
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John,
I had the stone bit in Iceland, it was stuck between the brake
disk and the backing plate, got it out by flexing the plate.
Regards, Clive
 
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Hey Jon-C-W
Thanks for the indepth advice as I would nearly expect from you (sorry but
you and others did give me these exspectations).
Hey Jon are you going to Salisbury or not. You will have to send me you
landline again.
I will have to just put up with the scretch and see what happens.
Tomorrow is mothers day so visits are taking up the time.
I also noticed the brakes are softer than before also the pads are new.
I cant fault you at all with your (the driver is the important part)
I did need assistance at one point (shame shame shame) on a slight slope
from left to right with a 3ft drop at the right side. The cruiser lost all
traction and kept sliding towards the drop.
The tyres were just full and then a layer of sticky mud and grass and other
things added to this. So I was riding on nice slippy saucers.
You are again right forward was no problem but sliding sidewards was a
problem, nothing to take grip.
I had to let another guy drive the cruiser to get past this and he had his
hands full doing it.
As usual I had one or two questions for him, now that is different.
Another vehicle took the same line as me and had no problem, so more
questions for the poor guy.
But again it boiled down to the tyres, on the other vehicle it had chunky
MTs with side lugs which meant it left a perfect foot print compared to my
slippy mark.
But I think a hugh difference is if (its not yours).
A lot of the mental time was spent thinking about damage and the cost, a
shame really, but now I know why guys have one for on road and one for off
road.
SNIP
You are getting there JB. This is why I will not subscribe to the
'Trac Edge' type of tyre, they have good forward push but the
sideways grip is not so good. Its only when you are slipping sideways
Jon what are Trac edge tyres and what have you found are good
sideways tyres. I think I will now have to invest in a set of MTs, but now
what ones are good at preventing sideways motion while giving good forward
grip, ah the choices.
SNIP
The auto box is good for climbing slippy hills but lacks the engine stopping
power coming down and tends to let you move just a little too fast even in
the low and L.
The guy explained to me that the auto is good for climbing
because it will change without losing momenum but the manual is better for
steep desents.
SNIP
Good man, you are observant. This is just why old Luddites like me
don't like auto boxes (other listers too), you should try it in
packed snow going downhill with an autobox.
Now I know Im mad at times but no thanks, no way, no how.
SNIP
Re-write that one JB. A well equipped TLC is better than any other
ill-equipped 4X4.
Thats what I said.
Cheers Jon
John
92HDJ 80 1HDT Rep of Ireland
 
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Or, a well equiped TLC is better than any other well equiped 4x4.
Regards, Clive.
On 3/25/06, John Byrne <[Email address removed]> wrote:
t
l
er
s
y
f
od
w
d
ing
in
r
 
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On 3/25/06, John Byrne <[Email address removed]> wrote:
That's great!
That's not so great!
y
John, don't expect ARB or TJM bumpers are indestructible. They're only
made of 4mm steel,
Smaller cars are more agile off-road but cannot compare to the LC80 in
terms of engine power and load carrying. It''s horses for courses. And
even a well equipped LC has overhangs.
And, as Jon mentioned - it's all about experience. Know your car's
strong and weak points and avoid obvious problems.
--
Rgds,
Roman (London, UK)
'92 HDJ80
 
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Hey Roman
SNIP
That's not so great!
Ah Roman for me it is really, I was chuffed with the day. I
know its not much for you but 5 laps is enough for me going at a snails
pace. It takes hours to do.
SNIP
John, don't expect ARB or TJM bumpers are indestructible. They're only made
of 4mm steel,
Really is that all, I thought they would be thicker than
that. So what is the original bumpers thickness.
SNIP
Smaller cars are more agile off-road but cannot compare to the LC80 in terms
of engine power and load carrying. It''s horses for courses. And even a well
equipped LC has overhangs.
Now there is a lot in what you say.
It did have a load of power to basically plough through all at will with out
any bother at all.
SNIP
And, as Jon mentioned - it's all about experience. Know your car's
strong and weak points and avoid obvious problems.
Geese I guess I did learn a hell of a lot and still the
information is being processed as I type.That is where I am trying to get.
Can you tell me at what angle the cruiser would fall onto its side.
Does low inflated tyres, or the height of rubber below the wheel rim have
any bearing on this angle. My braking power has really got worse to the
point that I can bearly stop the cruiser. The grinding sound is constant and
very loude when braking. And it hasn't stopped raining all day so could not
check them. But the brake fluid resovoir is full so no leak.
cheers
john 92HDJ 80 1HDT
Rep of Ireland
 
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On 3/26/06, John Byrne <j
JOhn,
e
You should be allright at 30-35 deg. But do not try this at home and
avoid the "inclinometer" dashboard gadget like in the Pajero. Better
keep your eyes the terrain.
and
ot
If you keep going on like this, you run the risk of knackering the
brake disks - better do not drive until you check the brakes.
Rgds,
Roman (London, UK)
'92 HDJ80
 
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Hey Roman
I think you are starting to read my mind at times. I was thinking about the
inclinometer for my dash. I did a 30deg in water ditch and I was waiting for
the ahhhhhhhhhh shit we are now on our side.
There was two of them together and I made it into the second one but lost
all forward traction and had to reverse out of the two of them, they called
them Sheep Dips. They also had a 40deg one but I passed due to a previous
heart condition from the first two.
I am going to check it in the morning and if unsure will pay a trip to mr T,
cant be stupid with brakes after all.
john
92HDJ 80 1HDT Rep of Ireland
 
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Thanks Jeff
So its not just me who feared for his panels at angles.I could not have walked the route unless I went for a swim in cold muddy water ahshiver me --------. What difference will a lifted cruiser make to the angle and is there a way of working it out , without the obvious one of wait untill you hear the bang.
john
92HDj 80 1HDT repof ireland
 
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Hi Guys
Just thought I would let you know the outcome of the scretching noise
regarding the brakes.
I brought it to mrT and it took them nearly three hours to fix the problem.
I has lost pads on the right rear and so was grinding metal to metal when
using the brakes.
The two rear calipers and pistons were seized and had to be stripped down
etc. So I know im a chicken by leaving it in to them but there is no way I
could have fixed that probelm and its best to be safe when it comes to the
brakes.
They put it down to time.
The result is a great responsive brake pedal and a lot of piece of mind.
While I was there I looked for the filter for the Auto box but the guy could
not fint it listed and had never been asked for one before. The part no we
think is it is 35330-60010 is that it.
I thought it was a lot smaller and cheaper if that is it
Thanks for the help guys.
cheers
john 92HDJ 80 1HDT Rep of Ireland
 
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John,
I have the exact same problem with one of my back brakes.
Coming back from Newmarket the other day the brakes started to squeel a
bit and I just assumed that it was the squeal shims that are fitted
warning me that they would need changing, however 3/4 of the way back
after stopping for a break the brakes let go completely in a car park
leaving brake fluid on the floor.
I limped back and stripped it down over the weekend and it turns out
the the squeel shims didn't (squeel) and I had initially the pad metal
rubbing on the disk, but then the remains of the pad slipped out of the
way and lodged itself between the disk and the guard.
This then left the piston to come out of the calliper and act on the
disks, providing me with braking for the last (slow) 50 miles!
Anyway, I have new disks, piston and seal kit on order and will sort it
out this weekend.
The thing that concerns me is that the pads were only put on about 6500
miles ago - I know the disks were looking a bit thin but expected them
to last a fair bit longer - I had put them down for replacement
sometime in the summer.
The pads were from Milner and I get the impression that they just don't
last as long as the Toyota ones. Also I find that they don't brake as
well, fade more quickly and also throw out a lot more black brake dust.
Bottom line is I wouldn't recommend them to anyone, they are too cheap.
In future I'll stick to either the Toyota ones or replacements from a
reputable manufacturer like Ferodo.
One other point is that Toyota also supply a 'cheap' pad for the front,
branded as Optifit that are about half the price of the normal ones.
They are Toyota approved and I gather that they have the same brake
material - I might give them a try this time around.
--
Regards,
Julian Voelcker
Mobile: 07971 540362
Skype: julianvoelcker
Cirencester, United Kingdom
1994 HDJ80, 2.5" OME Lift
 
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Hey Julian
Sorry to hear about your bother, I was beginning to think that I was the
only one that seems to have these problems with the cruiser.
I know that most of your braking power comes from the front but geese when
your rear brakes are not working and you only manage to stop just in time,
makes you think.
My discs are ok as is the piston.
The discs that milner sell what are they like anyone know because they are
cheaper but as good as Toy I dont know.
I would only use the Toy pads because I dont believe in hoping the pads will
be Ok I prefere to know they will be Ok.
I asked the guy what would cause the pads to just decide to leave without
warning and he said something like too much pressure.
John 92HDJ 80 1HDT
rep of Ireland
 
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