Question for all you self employed

[karl webster]

Your right rich. One of my customers had some groundworkers do some work and I said to her that I needed to take over from them. The photo below is there attention to detail. It's appalling.



These were some steps to a patio. It actually looks how it should now though

 

[chapel gate]

As trades people we often don't sell ourselves as well as we should do. A note with a quote stating that there's no hidden extras for a top quality job might help if you make it a leaflet or something light hearted maybe and saying your price is guaranteed all in…are the others? Also often people buy on the person in front of them, on how much they like them. A website can really help with that to showcase work and put some personal touches in.

I'm by no means the cheapest, I often say I'm 'reassuringly expensive' like the Stella ad. I don't advertise, never have and although it's just me I've had good patches and bad. It's always a feast or a famine.

One thing you could consider doing is a simple 3 fold A4 leaflet showing you at work, pencil behind ear and some of your work pieces and ask if you can leave some with local estate agents. It's no skin off their nose to promote your work and if it helps them get a sale they'll be all for it especially the more traditional properties where plastic ( ) is a no no.

Have you done kitchens? I mean bespoke fitted kitchens.

Kinda what i was trying to get at rich. You wont compete in price with the run of the mill stuff as a soletrader with a workshop These days.
be "exclusive" and charge accordingly. Call yourself the joinery artisan or something.
the trouble with barry down the road is he wont see where the money isin the price you gave him to make a front door when he can get a upvc for £260. Or a timber one off the shelf from the builders merchant.

 

[karl webster]

All you need to do is get together....
Looks like we have all the trades here in one place. Just need a string of footballers who want new estates with garages for 5 cars and boom -sorted.
Cruiser Builders perhaps?

Working with other people is hard Ben. We all have different morals (some lower than others). Finding good honest people isn't easy.

 

[Towpack]

Even though I'm not self employed and as someone who would be paying for building services etc, I submit that doing a quality job is the most important factor. We've fell foul in the past of going for the cheapest quotes and ending up with a poor job done. Nowadays, if we need some trade work doing, we do some homework, ask around for recommendations and a look at some work done. Paying a premium price for a quality job isn't really a premium 'cos it will last. "Do it once and do it right" is the way to go, as seems to be the work ethic with you guys. A friend of mine had some electrical work done and it was disgraceful. Wiring not fastened down correctly, sockets mounted skewiff etc.., all by a Part P qualified electrician. I ended up going round to tidy things up.

 

[StarCruiser]

This is true Karl, the right people are hard to come by.

Brian, have you thought while you're not busy, of knocking up some small show pieces. Easily transportable cutaway joints and windows and corners of sashes, that sort of thing. Props if you like. Along with sonevtake-away info, doing things like fetes or table top sales in more affluent areas may generate some interest. It's not going to happen overnight but people get to meet you and see your work and your passion for what you do. They may not buy, themselves, but they may well tell others. Maybe make some furniture to sell later on. There's so much out there that's factory made and the same as the people at No 14 have, especially front doors, individuality adds value in spades.

Furniture can be sold as an item and delivered anywhere in the world with the right marketing.

 

[StarCruiser]

A friend of mine had some electrical work done and it was disgraceful. Wiring not fastened down correctly, sockets mounted skewiff etc.., all by a Part P qualified electrician. I ended up going round to tidy things up.

In the 80s I worked for an NICEIC registered firm. They were based behind and also ran a TV rental, sales and repair shop. The guv'nor was a TV engineer who could BS for England. They had one or two guys who knew their stuff and the rest were anyone who could hold a pair of pliers. If they were fast so much the better. Whenever the NIC inspector called he was shown jobs from the good guys and told that all the test meters (which they didn't own) were in being repaired. I decided never to be a member of such an organisation as I realised how little it policed things.

Part P is not a qualification though lots of people offer it as such. It is a part of the building regulations and is pretty confusing because it doesn't apply to all electrical work. It applies to certain parts of domestic work and was born out of an MP's daughter being tragically killed in her kitchen by touching a metal plate rack fixed through a live wire while she had her other hand in the metal sink. The wires were installed diagonally across the wall by whoever had installed the kitchen and the fixings for the rack were drilled where there should have been no wires.

The upshot of this is that courses sprang up to give people like kitchen fitters, training enough to do what they needed to do and for domestic electricians to also get on a register something along the lines of Corgi. There's many decent electricians out there on a 'competent person scheme' which allows signing off of Part P notifiable work. The problem is there's also many who use this to get work and aren't really that good but people assume they are because they have a Part P sticker on their van.

When this came about, I took the opportunity to go towards the industrial/commercial sector where there are fewer sole traders. It's more what I want to do anyway but it's beginning to be influenced by the paperwork brigade wanting risk assessments and method statements which just annoy me but I'll have to comply soon. That's another area where all the paperwork can be top notch and hide people who know nothing of how to do the job properly. In my view, all these schemes to try and 'raise standards' do the opposite by promoting a false sense of security. The industry in general is being 'dumbed down' as apprenticeships are reduced in length to try and attract kids away from keyboards.

Rant over (if that's what it was)

 

[Towpack]

+1. Hiring a 'qualified' person in no way guarantees a good job. IMO quality comes from integrity, motivation and the will to things the right way even if it's the long way. You can't buy that on a training scheme. JMO

 

[chapel gate]

Even though I'm not self employed and as someone who would be paying for building services etc, I submit that doing a quality job is the most important factor. We've fell foul in the past of going for the cheapest quotes and ending up with a poor job done. Nowadays, if we need some trade work doing, we do some homework, ask around for recommendations and a look at some work done. Paying a premium price for a quality job isn't really a premium 'cos it will last. "Do it once and do it right" is the way to go, as seems to be the work ethic with you guys. A friend of mine had some electrical work done and it was disgraceful. Wiring not fastened down correctly, sockets mounted skewiff etc.., all by a Part P qualified electrician. I ended up going round to tidy things up.

As you say, i think the only way is to look at a couple of jobs they have done, and make up your own mind that it is the standard your after. Tbh most things can look good in a picture.
Forget architect recommended too, theyll more than likely be getting a "drink" out of it.

i even know two brickies who were giving a building inspector a back hander...

 

[joinerman]

Well I have been busy today ( not work related ) & just caught up on this thread, some good ideas from all of you which i take on board so thanks to ALL of you.

Like Rich i have never advertised, never needed to all my work has always come by recommendation, as i said earlier i am not looking to build an empire at my age plus the body won't let me, minds willing but body ! NO

Thanks again all.

 

[Brian S]

bespoke fitted kitchens.

Friend of mine does this locally, does very well with it, and he does all the other stuff in between doing kitchens and bedrooms

 

[lc99g]

You simply cannot compete with upvc and if you try you will simply lose money. As above, put yourself out there via FB/estate agents /flyers etc and call yourself bespoke and expensive, there are always customers that want to pay for the best and also in my experience they want to be seen to be paying and getting the best. If you are good at what you do, honest, and have a way with customers it might surprise you what you can get work wise.
Good luck. Stan.

 

[froggy Steve]

We have just asked a local Carpenter lad (taken over from Dad) to make us 4 windows for our cottage - they are all different non standard sizes, he has to get the double glazing in and made up special..........April he recons
OK we are in France but everyone seems busy, Artisan wise. We have a building co in at the moment and he is flat out, but all our work is inside, so on wet days he comes to us I stop work around November till March, apart from security checks etc. New enquiries come in all the time and I dont advertise, just have a 'fun' website that seems to do the trick.
A website in my opinion is the way to go. Make it enjoyable, interesting with photos (no music!) Can be made pretty cheaply by pro's nowadays. have a look at mine www.dspsfrance.com

 

[joinerman]

Well I have just joined Bookface Trying to get me head round it, i can see my daughter's going to get a call for help. LOL

 

[karl webster]

The offer still stands Brian if you want to send me some details

 

[hamba]

May I suggest you try and get listed on Google maps as well, I've been using it lately for nearly everything I am searching for.
Also get a nice little website up as that is normally where I'll try and contact someone from after finding them on Google maps.