80 series petrol or diesel

[Towpack]

The biggest threat to vehicle values IMO is the climate change band wagon and it's gathering pace lately with the focus on the numerous floods and wild fires happening round the globe. There's another big COP26 meeting in November with accelerated anti carbon fuel measures being called for so we'll have to see what that brings.

 

[stuzbot]

The biggest threat to vehicle values IMO is the climate change band wagon...

This ^^

Even if I had the money [which I don't] I'd be wary of spending more than a few grand on an ICE motor these days. Because I'd worry about how many years I'd get out of it before it was effectively legislated out of existence. I think the tipping point for adoption of electric vehicles is pretty much upon us and, it's going to become more and more expensive to run an ICE engined vehicle. Most of us, who don't have deep pockets will just be priced out of driving one.

I don't think the UK government will actually go so far as banning ICE vehicles. That's not their style. It'll be a 'death of 1000 cuts' with an extra tax here, an extra surcharge there, all dressed up as being 'green' rather than the cynical money grabbing exercise it is. And there will be more and more towns and cities banning non-electric vehicles. It'll just end up being too expensive and too much hassle to run one.

Like most of us on here, I'd love an 80 Series. But, even if I found a wodge of cash down the back of the sofa, I'd be a bit wary of spending 5 figures on a motor I might only get to enjoy for a year or two.

 

[Higgy]

No one Knows really what's going to happen, Especially us mere mortals, But with everyone telling us we have to go Green and Electric i dont get how Old Diesel burners are rising in price, I would have thought it would have the Opposite effect.... But my Brains capacity reaches a certain point then gives up. I know what i know and thats it...... Im not considering selling my 80 because i cant afford to run it, Its because circumstances have changed, Plus now i don't have my workshop or ramp i cant just pop it on and sort things that need doing, Plus there is no one round here i would want to take it to when things need fixing... Its just something to take into consideration that's all........ Its only a consideration, I probably will never sell......... BUT I never thought i would have to get rid of my 12v project, I had so many plans for that... But after 2 days of selling it, I had forgotten i ever owned it.... Weird isnt it

 

[stuzbot]

But with everyone telling us we have to go Green and Electric i dont get how Old Diesel burners are rising in price...

My guess is that people are banking on older vehicles [especially pre-2000] continuing to enjoy their slightly more privileged tax position [based on engine size, rather than emissions] and, of course eventually becoming tax and MOT -exempt. The former was one of the reasons I went for a pre-2001 model, when buying mine.

However, the cynic in me thinks that even those older ICEs will be living on borrowed time. Once all the newer ones have been taxed and legislated off the roads, and everyone gone electric, you can guarantee that they'll start turning their attention on all those older ones that are currently allowed to fly under the radar.

 

[Towpack]

The target is "Net 0" which basically means any remaining "necessary" emmissions balanced out by the carbon removed by carbon capture and reforestation etc. There's no way owners of old vehicles will get a permanent exemption, maybe an extension in the short term but that will come at an ever increasing price. Having said that, any measures have to be acceptable to the general population. There must be tens of millions of people, running a car on a budget, who need one through absolute necessity where alternatives either don't exist, are inconvenient or too expensive. Wether it's for day to day life, shopping, school runs, etc or needed for employment, potentially forcing these people off the road is NOT going to go down well, no matter how much the activists kick off. JMO

 

[Theshootist]

We are certainly going to be able to drive ICEs in fewer and fewer towns going forward. I'm not convinced that digging the world's supply of lithium and cobalt out of far flung places, shipping it back and forth across the world is much better than keeping an older car going. Also the modern diesel engines, with the ad blu technology, are very good on emissions now compared to older engines.

 

[Theshootist]

No one Knows really what's going to happen, Especially us mere mortals, But with everyone telling us we have to go Green and Electric i dont get how Old Diesel burners are rising in price, I would have thought it would have the Opposite effect.... But my Brains capacity reaches a certain point then gives up. I know what i know and thats it...... Im not considering selling my 80 because i cant afford to run it, Its because circumstances have changed, Plus now i don't have my workshop or ramp i cant just pop it on and sort things that need doing, Plus there is no one round here i would want to take it to when things need fixing... Its just something to take into consideration that's all........ Its only a consideration, I probably will never sell......... BUT I never thought i would have to get rid of my 12v project, I had so many plans for that... But after 2 days of selling it, I had forgotten i ever owned it.... Weird isnt it

Is it worth us having a conversation Higgy? I know I'm probably in a long que of interested parties - but if I don't ask I'll never know!

 

[RichC4]

I'd say we have 10-20 years before things get to be a real problem. Most cars sold now are still ICE (even if hybrid) so that gives ~10 years of ICE cars on the road.

Once electric becomes the thing getting fuel might be the first major issue. Though unless tractors and similar machinery go electric there will still be diesel at least (or you can run it on chip fat).

As for being allowed to drive, I imagine there'll be some classic car scheme whereby classic ICE vehicles are still allowed to drive (probably not into cities or for a fee) even if new vehicles have to be electric.

 

[Towpack]

There are numerous "incentives" that could be used to persuade people out of their old diesels/petrols. Driving restrictions, increased road tax, fuel tax, tighter MOT's, insurance tax etc, long before an outright ban is implemented. When these start to kick in then that's when prices will start to crash IMO. I guess these moves and the timescale haven't been finalised yet but it's not if but when.

 

[chapel gate]

personally i dont think they will make a huge effort to get 30 plus year old vehicles off the road. as long as diesel is available im not overly worried tbh.

who knows where we will be in 10-20 years? if the weather continues to get more severe, i cant think of many other vehicles id rather be in than an 80 in a bad situation..

 

[Theshootist]

Thoughts? 1997/P Toyota Land Cruiser 80 VX Limited 4.5 Petrol/LPG Auto *133,000 MILES!* | eBay - [Leaving Land Cruiser Club]

Its a duel fuel hybrid.. (!)

 

[Higgy]

Its a grand looking thing il give it that, MOT advisories ????? Looks like it needs new shocks and discs all round, Plus pads... Last Fail in 2019 says the usual things, Brake pipe corrosion, Not the end of the world...... It does look good 'tho'...... Go on treat 'yer sen'...... One thing, Il never understand why folk keep their trucks all clean and shiny, But neglect things like Discs, pads, Shocks etc, Basically the things that keep it on the road and make it Stop!!!.....Expect rust underneath..

 

[AndycruiserguyLomas]

Its ok if you don't mind Japan spec trim rather than UK spec leather.
No mention of corrosion mentioned though.

 

[Theshootist]

I don't mind the fabric at all. I'm betting its just the LSD at the rear though rather than the lockers. I've spoken to the seller who took it in part exchange. He doesn't know, but will send me a video tomorrow.

 

[RichC4]

I might be weird, but I kind of prefer fabric seats.

 

[AndycruiserguyLomas]

Could well be a good 80, I'd want to know it had had a "Flashlube" system fitted to protect the valves. Don't be fooled by the LPG being cheap to run, I've had two and the gas was gone in no time, it worked out at 11 to the gallon as it doesn't have the same calorific value of petrol.

 

[Theshootist]

I've not run an LPG car before but that does reflect what I've read. The seller said the gentleman who part exchanged it loved it bit couldn't handle the full costs anymore! He had no idea if it had a flashlube system. I would certainly want to run a compression test.

 

[Jacob100]

I had a V8 4x4 with LPG for a short while and it was a pain. You went out of your way to find an LPG station and they were closed or out of gas. Took ages to fill up. Minimal range on petrol alone if like me you had opted for a smaller tank. Not available at all in some countries and regions. Constant fuel anxiety.

Brilliant fuel in principle and more people should use it but I think it makes more sense to get the most out of a smaller car where fuel economy and range is not an issue in itself.

 

[Higgy]

Agree, Got a few mates who had gas system fitted to their motors...'Nowt' but a pain in the arse, If you have a big petrol Engine, Gas isnt going to make much difference,........ And if fuel consumption is an issue, Get a Diesel..... To be fair any big 4x4 is 'Gonna' sup fuel whatever it is........ I personally would have petrol without the Gas system fitted......

 

[Theshootist]

I don't think the LPG systems are particularly invasive so could always be removed.