Can a 100 series run on Veg Oil?

[Northern Monkey]

Not sure if this is the forum to post on. I know a lot has been written about veg oil, but I can't find an answer to my questions.

I am just about to buy a Land Cruiser and I would like a 100 series 1999-2005 or there about. Diesel, 4.2 and probably auto (as manuals appear to be very rare). But...I am loking for something that I can run on veg oil with a 2-tank conversion kit.

I am told that engines with common rail, or preferably Nippon Denso injection pumps, are best for veg oil use.

Q:1. Is the 4.2 diesel for this period a common rail or does it have a ND injection pump?
Q:2. If not, has anyone been running their 100 series dielsel on veg oil (not bio)?
Q:3. Or should I be looking at something else, such as a 90 series?

Any advice would be very welcome.

 

[nathanrobo]

Earlier Nippon Denso pumps probably to about 04 will be direct injection - fly by wire (not sure exactly when they changed). Either way, the pump should be considered too fussy on the 4.2 for veg oil. AFAIK any diesel 100 series will run on very well made bio (100% reaction and meticulously polished).

Generally speaking using WVO should be reserved for vehicles of low value. What do I mean by that? There are many professional twin tank conversions functioning well (I know a guy who's done it on a 90 series). But the real concern is polymerisation... Just look at your frying pan or wok! That glazing / ring gumming can jam piston rings solid in their grooves. Plus thanks to the incomplete burn your engine oil will become diluted with veg oil and need regular change outs! If your driving a car worth a few hundred quid, why not? But if you've some cash tied up in your car, it's either Derv, or invest in a bio processor with a wet wash / drying system, plus dry wash tower, centrifuge and polish pots and learn from somebody who's been doing it for a while. Anyone can make bio, but good quality bio requires a bit of knowledge

 

[Graham]

Great reply Nathanrobo,
I know you have been making high quality bio for a number of years.
I would be interested to know the latest year the ND inj. pump can run happy on veggie.

Gra.
pm sent

 

[Ben]

Earlier Nippon Denso pumps probably to about 04 will be direct injection - fly by wire (not sure exactly when they changed). Either way, the pump should be considered too fussy on the 4.2 for veg oil. AFAIK any diesel 100 series will run on very well made bio (100% reaction and meticulously polished).

Generally speaking using WVO should be reserved for vehicles of low value. What do I mean by that? There are many professional twin tank conversions functioning well (I know a guy who's done it on a 90 series). But the real concern is polymerisation... Just look at your frying pan or wok! That glazing / ring gumming can jam piston rings solid in their grooves. Plus thanks to the incomplete burn your engine oil will become diluted with veg oil and need regular change outs! If your driving a car worth a few hundred quid, why not? But if you've some cash tied up in your car, it's either Derv, or invest in a bio processor with a wet wash / drying system, plus dry wash tower, centrifuge and polish pots and learn from somebody who's been doing it for a while. Anyone can make bio, but good quality bio requires a bit of knowledge

Do you really believe that?

 

[adrianr]

I think it's a valid consideration Ben.

For me I ensure no long periods of idle, if I'm sat more than a few minutes two ill set the hand throttle around 1400 rpm.

Regular loading on the engine or frequent hard sustained acceleration until no more smoke from the exhaust.

And
Before each oil change at 3k I run a lot of steam into the air intake after the filter. Usually for about 15 mins or so.

 

[Graham]

Well, reading back the post, I can't see a real answer ?

Are we saying that up to 2004, that they can run on Ben's veggie oil, mixed with diesel I guess, or some thing cheaper and similar !

Gra.

 

[Ben]

Regarding the piston rings gumming up and jamming...........................

Karl has done thousands of miles on waste veg oil, without any problems. As have I and many others.

 

[Graham]

Not sure if this is the forum to post on. I know a lot has been written about veg oil, but I can't find an answer to my questions.

I am just about to buy a Land Cruiser and I would like a 100 series 1999-2005 or there about. Diesel, 4.2 and probably auto (as manuals appear to be very rare). But...I am loking for something that I can run on veg oil with a 2-tank conversion kit.

I am told that engines with common rail, or preferably Nippon Denso injection pumps, are best for veg oil use.

Q:1. Is the 4.2 diesel for this period a common rail or does it have a ND injection pump?
Q:2. If not, has anyone been running their 100 series dielsel on veg oil (not bio)?
Q:3. Or should I be looking at something else, such as a 90 series?

Any advice would be very welcome.

.
Hi NM,


I don't believe any of the 100 series diesels you are mentioning, ie, 1999 to 2005 are common rail fuel system.
The common rail engines don't run on veggie oil.
At least, I don't think any 100 series 1999 to 2005 are common rail, but sure as eggs are eggs, there will be some one far more knowledgeable than me on these 4,2L engines than me.

Gra.

 

[nathanrobo]

Do you really believe that?

Hi Ben

I've seen both engines with serious polymerisation, piston rings solid in their grooves and hear of LC owners who promote veg oil use but have serious evidence of oil levels increasing as a result of veg oil mixing in the sump. A sure sign that there's a problem. I love my LC and would risk it!

 

[roscoFJ73]

One reason I would not run a 1HD FTE engine on bio is that the fuel pump is so damn expensive to repair.
There was no common rail until the 1VD FTE V8 diesel in the 200 and 70 series and the 1KD FTV in the Prado

 

[Julian T]

Do you really believe that?

Yes I do.

 

[Ben]

Hi Ben

I've seen both engines with serious polymerisation, piston rings solid in their grooves and hear of LC owners who promote veg oil use but have serious evidence of oil levels increasing as a result of veg oil mixing in the sump. A sure sign that there's a problem. I love my LC and would risk it!

I know of some one who runs his 80 on waste veg oil and hes said his sump oil level does rise over time. Ive never found this with mine, but I dont use waste oil only new.

I plan on stripping and rebuilding my engine at some point, as its currently done over 200,000 miles. When I do it will be interesting to see if the piston rings are gummed up.

I will post up here when I do with pics.

 

[nathanrobo]

Regarding the piston rings gumming up and jamming...........................

Karl has done thousands of miles on waste veg oil, without any problems. As have I and many others.

You want to talk to karl... I have.

 

[nathanrobo]

.
Hi NM,


I don't believe any of the 100 series diesels you are mentioning, ie, 1999 to 2005 are common rail fuel system.
The common rail engines don't run on veggie oil.
At least, I don't think any 100 series 1999 to 2005 are common rail, but sure as eggs are eggs, there will be some one far more knowledgeable than me on these 4,2L engines than me.

Gra.

I'm not sure when the common rail kicked in (I thought it was 2004 - but happy to be corrected). I should have been clearer about what I was saying.

Due to Euro emission rules cars after about 2000 are no longer mechanical IP's, but fly-by wire Injection Pumps. These are very fussy about fuel - I would not use veg oil on anything other than a mechanical injection pump.

My experience was well documented on either here or the other forum. I was polishing my fuel at 3 micron prior to dispensing, but this wasn't good enough. What i'll refer to as sediment seemed to drop out and found it's way past the filter into the IP and blocked the I.P's internal filter.

It's well documented on the VOD forum that cars such as Audi, WV etc that just love veg oil, will no longer run on veg oil after 2000. Their injection pumps are far more tolerant than the denso pump. Saying that in my case it cost less than £400 to sort out using TT Automotive in Loughborough - 3 days of work though and in the cold.

Ref polymerisation, again there are many documented cases on the VOD forum where most of the alternative fuels types lurk. At the same time there are tales of peeps who have gotten away with it for many miles. It's still not a recommendation for others.

Ref Bio, my many years / miles on 100% and the experience of thousands of others, is a reasonable recommendation, that being said, the problem with bio is that when it's home made, quality will vary according to the producers knowledge, ability and the rigorousness of his process. In fact there will be a certain amount of variation from batch to batch, which is why testing is so important (particularly that a 100% conversion has taken place) and that the final polish is a good set up.

 

[Ben]

You want to talk to karl... I have.

I meant regarding piston/engine problems.

I know hes had to replace fuel pumps.

But hes using waste oil that hes filtered himself, not new oil like me.

if/when I strip my engine if theres any veg oil related damage I will quite happily post the pics and admit I was wrong.

I'm not too arrogant/big headed to admit when I've made a mistake!

 

[nathanrobo]

Ben

I hope you're getting away with it. New oil will have far fewer FFA's (if any - not sure) and if I'm right will gum up slightly less than WVO. There's a guy that has a hobby page about WVO use on a colorado type LC. He's been filtering WVO for some time and recently noticed an increase in the amount of veg oil getting through to his sump. I've spoken to many Veg oil users on various cars that report increased sump levels.

This would be a sign of rings glued into their grooves? The truth about veg oil is that it doesn't burn as completely as diesel or biodiesel. The situation is even worst when the engine is cold.

Btw I've not come across anyone on the LC forums who's been arrogant or unpleasant in any way (this is just lively debate and very worthwhile - fuel is a big issue for LC owners). LC owners are gents / scholars and a lot more friendly than other forums that I've been on.

With regards to purchasing new oil a worthwhile question is given the cost, is it worth the risk. Even WVO at 10p per litre plus the cost of filtering (heating, dewatering, the cost of filters or a centrifuge kit). You would have to use a lot to save enough to cover the risk of engine damage. Even a IP stripped out and sent off would set you back £400 plus sundry costs and your time.