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Experience with installing a block / engine heater?

spnk

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moldova
As I've already taken care of the tire question, now it's time to install a block heater, as winters are quite cold here in Finland, and it can easily get under -30C, and stay like that for a week.

Now I've already visited a couple of mechanics and both of them said that the whole system + approximately three hours of work would cost me around 750-900 euros, and it's kind of hard not to think of this price as being waayyyy too high. Normally here you would pay around 250-300 euros for the whole thing, but for this money you can buy a pretty ok-ish car..

Their explanation for the high price is that they have to build the heating system from zero, but they actually also appeared genuinely surprised by the cost themselves, so I guess it's just that this particular system that's for sale in Finland is that expensive (it's around 500-650 euros).

So, what I would like to know is if by any chance any of you has ever installed one these heaters on their 90's? Maybe a Webasto, or something else?

I'm thinking about ordering the parts myself from somewhere outside of Finland, in order to cut the costs.
There's this Russian made block heater called "CEBEPC", and people seem to be pretty happy with it. And it costs only 50 to 90 euros, depending on the specifications, which in this case is nothing! I'm just afraid that the mechanic wouldn't have a clue on how to install it, as I doubt that they have the instructions in English as well.
 
They're also called Viscous Heaters or Power Heaters, by the way.
 
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Iv fitted a few engine block water heaters in Boat engines. The owners were embarrassed when they started up their posh Boats and filled the Marina with white smoke.. So I would fit an in line heater, Just tap into the Rad and the engine block. And turn on 10mins before start up it just circulates warm water, No white smoke on start up... You can get them with Thermo's and timers..They are surprisingly compact.
 
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They're also called Viscous Heaters or Power Heaters, by the way.

My '100 VX' has a Power Heater as standard. Its a pump, driven by the ancillary belt with an electro-mechanical clutch like that on the Air Con pump. Its connected to the cabin heater piping and stirs the coolant (heatant in this case) by imparting energy. It's primary function is to warm the car's interior quickly.

It is, of course, linked to a gang of ECUs such that when engaged it lifts the engine RPM to speed things up. When engaging 'D/2/L' the revs drop back to normal.

It does work but doesn't really warm the engine faster except through increasing the load & revs.

My understanding of a Block Heater is to warm the engine block to give the starter motor a chance in extreme low temps. It should prevent the coolant from freezing and cracking the block, radiator and pipework. It also helps to preserve fan and ancillary belts that can freeze and break when really cold.

I have seen pictures of parking meters in Canada and N. America which have power outlets so that electric block heaters can be used whilst parked. Running one from a battery would probably require a separate 'Leisure Battery' with a Split-Charging System.

Have a look at the thread on 'Chinese Diesel Heaters' - something like that might be OK but as one may produce vapour in cold weather I would check local laws, you wouldn't want the local Fire Brigade getting involved !

Bob.
 
Kenlowe used to make a engine pre heater kit that was a diy installation.not sure if they still make them but maybe you could find one Kbytes web?
 
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I would imagine an electric system is going to take a lot of juice. Ok if it’s only for10 minutes for starting but if you need to heat the engine for long periods, like when parked in really cold climates to stop the block freezing etc I can’t see it being workable.
Once you get down to -25 or more all your fluids start to sticky up, engine oil, power steering fluid etc, so a pre heater certainly has value in making sure everything is adequately lubricated from the get go. You don’t want pistons banging up and down when the engine oil is like treacle!
 
With access to mains electricity I’d be looking at something like this....https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/3kW-230V...896423?hash=item33e5cf3e27:g:LzQAAOSwfoNaXHjO

Power costs/tariffs obviously vary enourmously. The specs say around 30mins to warm the engine and one of these would cost me under 40p/hr to run. A self contained Webasto or Eiberspacher may well be cheaper to run but comparing the initial purchase cost and added complexity of installation, for me it’s a no brainier.
 
If you look at Bob Murphy's post my 2001 KDJ90 has the same fitted as factory standard so if you can source one in a junk yard .......
 
I remember seeing a TV programme years ago about life in Siberia. They showed a Lada Niva (I've always wanted one) which came with a built-in grate below the sump so that you could build a small fire underneath.

Not very practical, but I guess it would work!
 
With access to mains electricity I’d be looking at something like this....https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/3kW-230V...896423?hash=item33e5cf3e27:g:LzQAAOSwfoNaXHjO

Power costs/tariffs obviously vary enourmously. The specs say around 30mins to warm the engine and one of these would cost me under 40p/hr to run. A self contained Webasto or Eiberspacher may well be cheaper to run but comparing the initial purchase cost and added complexity of installation, for me it’s a no brainier.

That looks like a simpler version of the Kenlowe block heater which used to be available years ago. I bought one in the 80's when I got the Chevy Blazer 6.2 diesel. only to find that it already had a factory version installed in the block itself. So there it has sat in its box on the shelf for the past 30 years.
 
I've still got one that had been installed in another vehicle but I've never tried to fit it again because I no longer have the instruction notes, if you still have them in your box Andy could you scan them and forward to me please. :pray:
 
As I've already taken care of the tire question, now it's time to install a block heater, as winters are quite cold here in Finland, and it can easily get under -30C, and stay like that for a week.

Now I've already visited a couple of mechanics and both of them said that the whole system + approximately three hours of work would cost me around 750-900 euros, and it's kind of hard not to think of this price as being waayyyy too high. Normally here you would pay around 250-300 euros for the whole thing, but for this money you can buy a pretty ok-ish car..

Their explanation for the high price is that they have to build the heating system from zero, but they actually also appeared genuinely surprised by the cost themselves, so I guess it's just that this particular system that's for sale in Finland is that expensive (it's around 500-650 euros).

So, what I would like to know is if by any chance any of you has ever installed one these heaters on their 90's? Maybe a Webasto, or something else?

I'm thinking about ordering the parts myself from somewhere outside of Finland, in order to cut the costs.
There's this Russian made block heater called "CEBEPC", and people seem to be pretty happy with it. And it costs only 50 to 90 euros, depending on the specifications, which in this case is nothing! I'm just afraid that the mechanic wouldn't have a clue on how to install it, as I doubt that they have the instructions in English as well.
Many Rover 75 diesels had Webasto pre heaters fitted - I think with a timer etc. - scrapyard? ebay?
 
which came with a built-in grate below the sump so that you could build a small fire underneath.
My old HiLux had a 2inch lift & on really cold mornings I used to get a shovel of embers from the stove & put them on an upturned tin bucket beneath the sump.- 15 was the lowest I've seen here though & I was going to work in the Audi & it coped well enough.The Kenlowe was a mains 220Av kit IIRC
 
I've still got one that had been installed in another vehicle but I've never tried to fit it again because I no longer have the instruction notes, if you still have them in your box Andy could you scan them and forward to me please. :pray:

I'll get to it tomorrow Chas
 
Many Rover 75 diesels had Webasto pre heaters fitted - I think with a timer etc. - scrapyard? ebay?
Walamar is correct. We used to have a Rover 75 diesel which had one (a 51 plate - later it was less common) Some did have timers and some also had optional remotes so you could warm the car up before venturing out into the cold.
 
What kind of heater are you looking for, @spnk ?
Electric (230 V) or fuel burning?
A block heater is normally a cylindrical heating element which is pressed into the engine block, put in place of one of those saucer shaped frost plugs. The ones I've seen are much to weak for a land cruiser engine, with a power of 400-500 watts. Then there are hose heaters (which is the most common electric engine heater for the 90-series) with a power of 1 to 3 kW, like the one linked to on ebay above here. They are normally put into the cabin heater hose (which then runs onwards to the engine block). I have tried a couple of them, and they had problems with sweating coolant, and sometimes the pump wouldn't start. Defa has some good one though. There are also contact heaters, which are fastened under the sump (can even go on the auto gearbox sump as additional heating).

Then you have the Webasto or Eber which burn fuel and heats the coolant. The benefit of those are that they work without mains connection, and can be used wherever you are. The do require a good biggish battery, but they heat the engine fast, and the cabin too if you want. Nice to have cell-phone remote for starting it remotely. There are cheaper versions (as mentioned on this forum), but I've only seen the air heater type. Do they come as water heaters as well?
 
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