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landcruiser hand brakes !!!!!!!

E009DAC5-BF55-4AC5-89D2-B3806D87E362.jpeg D8AA4855-FC48-40E0-8D46-8493A5774FD4.jpeg 5D186BA9-F842-4D33-8C86-912673A0F97B.jpeg O..... ok! Because I'm having these problems with the hb on my search and rescue team car and is what i had decided to do, but i guess that's out of the question now!
 
Well no reason why not as long as you can find a unit that works. The one that was available here worked at the transfer case end of the prop because there was more attachment points. The one you posted looked very different. If you set up the HB correctly on the 80 then it does work very well. The issues are in getting it set up correctly and keeping it like that.
 
I did a bit of research on hydraulic handbrakes a while back, they seem to work very well and not over difficult to fit. The levers are drift/ rally car style so would look crap in a 80, i would look at using the existing lever somehow. For the mot you are supposed to have a handbrake independent of the cars hydraulic braking system....
I bet there are not too many 80 handbrakes that would bring them to a stop on a long steep hill...
 
My old Disco, like most older LR’s, had a drum brake on the rear prop. With the brake fully on the drum was locked solid but you could rock the car too and fro due to the ‘slop’ in the transmission which I think is a characteristic of such setups. I also remember reading somewhere about not applying the HB when moving due to the stress it puts on the transmission components. For these reasons I think individually braked rear wheel setup on LC’s is more effective even if the adjustment can be problematic. The procedure posted up by Chris is obviously the way to go after replacing any components that are are showing excessive wear.
 
Just wondering, would the diameter of the tyres make much difference, i.e. the larger they are, do they exert more leverage ?
 
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I suppose in that case, with such big tyres it might just be beyond the design capabilities of the standard h/b setup. Chocks maybe ?
 
Probably (almost definitely) a silly idea, but if some sort of lever mechanism or suchlike to depress the brake pedal and lock it on could be devised, then there would be 4 wheel braking via the discs. A carefully designed and engineered length of 2x4 wedged against the seat would probably do it.:)
 
No not at all a silly idea, i had actually thought about it. But it would not be legal here in Iceland and since this is a rescue car that's not a option!
 
Probably (almost definitely) a silly idea, but if some sort of lever mechanism or suchlike to depress the brake pedal and lock it on could be devised, then there would be 4 wheel braking via the discs. A carefully designed and engineered length of 2x4 wedged against the seat would probably do it.:)
a simple version of the hydraulic handbrake. when you pull the lever a rod acts against a master cylinder which is part of the lever assembly, this is plumbed in to the rear brake lines so the rear pads are activated.
 
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Hydraulic brake locks are available as security against having your car stolen. Sometimes they do not hold the pressure too long but it's days not minutes.
 
I have had experience with hydraulic handbrakes before when I used to do drifting. A working cable handbrake is just as effective and far more reliable than a hydraulic. The trouble with hydraulic handbrakes is, unless they use seperate calipers they must be plumbed in line with the rear brakes. This makes bleeding the hydraulic handbrake and the rear brakes extremely difficult. Also when you press the brakes the cylinder for the hydraulic handbrake must move meaning either the lever must move or the linkage must have play in it to stop the lever moving about. Unless you specifically want only the rear brakes to be held a way of jamming the brake pedal down would be far better, but useless for a hill start etc. (A hydraulic lever handbrake would be good in this situation). There were also problems when the fluid heated and expanded but this would be less of a problem in a 4x4 application.

There really isnt a reason the drum and cable handbrake shouldn't be effective, but the rubbish master and slave cable system ruins it. Twin cables to the levers on each backplates and a compensator yoke on the body would be much better.
 
IIRC the legal side of having the handbrake and the foot brake hydraulic is in itself illegal? It was a long time ago but it was something along the line of there being two different actuating systems, for example foot brake fluid, and the hand brake mechanical? This could well be wrong but the gray matter and all that?

It was during the overhaul of many things back then, lorries for example had to have air that released the brakes as opposed to air to keep them on. Before that it was air over hydraulic, but then Bedford TK's had issues and they went to cable hand brakes, leaving the air over hydraulic for foot brakes.

The result for cars though was fluid for foot brake and cables for hand brakes.

I renewed pretty much everything on the 80 brakes in December 2015 so four and a half years ago, when I say pretty much everything I might not have replaced the handbrake lever? :)

Back then I used the FSM procedure to bed them in and have had a brilliant handbrake for the best part of that time. I am not casting doubt on anyone's mechanical skills here but after the drive/handbrake/ drive repeat procedure many don't get the car jacked up again and remove the wheels to readjust the brake shoes, it is a pain but is necessary, the other thing is when the wheels are off you must stack a few washers and refit the wheel nuts to make sure the disc/drum is back in place while tightening the adjustment, if not the disc/drum can 'cock' and give a false impression of the correct adjustment.

It was earlier in this year and when I noticed the extra 'tug' needed to hold my 80 on a hill, I am a 'park in gear' person so not too worried but decided a couple of months ago to check it out, I found an oil seal had failed and oiled up the shoes, so something else to be aware of. It was at this time the new (back in 2015) dog bones had a small for want of a better description compression marks where the shoes rest, they were replaced with new stock versions. I had purchased new harder steel and slightly longer dog bones a couple of years later but given how good the HB was I put them in a 'safe' place, they recently resurfaced! So I will use them when I put the whole lot back together.

The point to make here is when everything is new and adjusted correctly, the 80 handbrake should be good with no further attention needed for 80,000 miles/four years? I am using mine as an example here. As an aside the inside drum area of the disc never wears out........unless you or a previous person adjusted them wrong.

regards

Dave
 
You're right Dave, set up properly the handbrake should be good for a long time. The problem is and we're not quite sure why, the minute you off road it to any degree at all where the suspension articulates beyond what you'd get if only your Mum drove it, it vanishes. Something to do with pulling the cable on the axle maybe. But we've all had it. Handbrake is great until that first axle-twister and then it's gone. I wondered about some kind of arrangement where I could slacken the whole thing off before doing something like Lincomb, then re tension it when I've done. Not really an issue in an auto but in a manual it's a nightmare.
 
Nooooooooooooooooooo. not another handbrake thread ! i'm traumatised & have had to revert to Single malt to overcome the pain.
" the only thing that the Cruiser can fail on is a defective handbrake. It's always been the same"
I'ts not a bug , it's a feature .Crappy handbrakes are the norm on most vehicles i've owned , mid 90s Audis had an insanely complicated system , some sort of spiral inside the caliper , also common on other VAG models at the time. IMO the propshaft solution is the best.I worked Saturdays in a garage from the age of 14 & was taught never to use the handbrake whilst jacking up but to chock the outside of 2 opposing wheels.And of course axle stands.
 
Just by coincidence! I decided to check and adjust my handbrake recently. Finding the drum had some axle oil in there I decided to go the whole hog. Usual new shoes, pads (although pads not needed), it was only when assembling I decided to fit the lengthened strut when I found IMO that the new strut was simply too much longer? So I assembled with the OE version and then carried on putting it all back together. I did one side one day which included new axle and hub seals and pulled the bearings and cleaned and re-greased them. It was when putting the other side together I had a thought about the hold back springs or rather the pins, one straight and one cranked? One of the tricks the brain plays on us is automation without thinking about it, the arriving at a destination and not remembering passing through a certain town etc, or assembling brakes without thinking about it having done it hundreds of times on dozens of different marques so, did I put the pins in the correct side?

I have not yet checked the car but surely the cranked one has to go on the same side as the parking brake lever that is fixed to the shoe to operate the handbrake, on checking the FSM I think it is in fact printed wrong?

Page BR-57 clearly shows the cranked pin on the rear shoe and the straight pin on the front shoe, if I understand it correctly it should be the other way around?

I simply assemble in the logical way, I cannot see any reason for the cranked pin to be on the other shoe? Is this perhaps one of the reasons for getting the adjustment wrong, as the lever is being interefered with by the straight pin?

I will go out after the heat has eased off and pull the disc/drum and have a check, in the meantime anyone else seen this? And if it has been pointed out before feel free to give my wrists a slap.


regards

Dave
 
The cranked pin goes on the shoe with the actuating lever to give clearance during operation, that's how I've always remembered it.
 
Exactly! I just popped out and pulled one side down and yep I did fit the cranked pin on the lever side, but I will certainly pull down the other side later in the week just for peace of mind, it's too bloody hot at the moment.

I think it is safe to say the FSM is wrong, I guess 50 years of owning and working on cars did sink in. :)

regards

Dave
 
Just had a quick look at the FSM and you're spot on Dave, the exploded diagram shows the opposite! I've never noticed that before.
 
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