Migrants in Germany cause more trouble

[Pumpy]

I can't even remember now how much a week I paid in I just googled a compound interest rate calculator but it will only calculate from 1975 so at a guess on the amount paid in by me alone I made a guess at £19.50? (I don't know what the ROH contribution was) from that time it works out in the region of £ 1120543.27

bearing in mind I started work in 1959 as an apprentice that figure will be much higher.

I think you're owed a rather large refund mate

The ruling classes nicking over a million quid off the average pensioner (amongst other scams) that's democracy for you

 

[Chas]

I think you're owed a rather large refund mate

Yeah right, they're gonna do that aint they.

 

[Rob Cowell]

The problem is your (and your employer's) NI contributions don't get held in a secure, low interest bank account or bond gently accruing. Your dosh goes into a fund used to pay the current beneficiaries. Mostly pensioners, but also those on benefits for maternity, incapacity, unemployment, and a few others. We traditionally ran at a surplus and rightly or wrongly successive governments "borrowed" that surplus at a very low interest rate. A few years ago the surplus looked fairly healthy, but in the last few years with a stagnation in economic growth, and an increase in people wanting to draw from that pot the surplus is shrinking and at the current rate the pot dries up in around 2035. But the current rate won't continue in a nice straight line for the next 20 years. It could get worse, it could get better.

 

[Chas]

I can't even remember now how much a week I paid in I just googled a compound interest rate calculator but it will only calculate from 1975 so at a guess on the amount paid in by me alone I made a guess at £19.50? (I don't know what the ROH contribution was) from that time it works out in the region of £ 1120543.27

bearing in mind I started work in 1959 as an apprentice that figure will be much higher.

EDIT
The previous calculation was not correct, my wife, who's still working pays £75.66 a week NI contributions at that rate the previous figure comes to about £671527

 

[Rob Cowell]

EDIT
The previous calculation was not correct, my wife, who's still working pays £75.66 a week NI contributions at that rate the previous figure comes to about £671527

What interest rate are you using to calculate that? Bank of England base is 0.5%. Assuming for simplicity a constant £75/week over 49 years I make that about £215K. With interest being compounded annually.

 

[Chas]

What interest rate are you using to calculate that? Bank of England base is 0.5%. Assuming for simplicity a constant £75/week over 49 years I make that about £215K. With interest being compounded annually.

Don't know Rob I was using this calculator, my calculations could be all bollox.
http://www.scotlawcom.gov.uk/public...ative-memoranda/compound-interest-calculator/

 

[Rob Cowell]

Don't know Rob I was using this calculator, my calculations could be all bollox.
http://www.scotlawcom.gov.uk/public...ative-memoranda/compound-interest-calculator/

That's calculating compound interest on a principal sum (a one-off payment) with as a default daily compounding. Although I'm still not sure how you got your figure out out it
To calculate a regular payment over time (your £75/week), and factor in compound interest you want something like this one which allows for a regular addition. This one only works for an annual addition, so you could use 0 as the principal (on day 1 you haven't been paid so start with nothing) and 52*75 as the annual.

http://www.moneychimp.com/calculator/compound_interest_calculator.htm

You might be able to compound interest more frequently than annually but since this particular calculator only allows annual deposits it roughly evens out. There are more flexible calculators out there. The equation is a bit awkward to type where algebraic formulas aren't easily supported in the forum text editor.

 

[Chas]

OK Rob thanks, I've had no idea how to work out compound interest since I left school, I'm not about then even. I'll have a look at that site you gave.

 

[StarCruiser]

Eat the elderly?

I reckon they'd be awfully tough and besides I'm fresh out of Chianti…might go alright in a curry I suppose…


[emoji6]

 

[clivehorridge]

Well i said my last farewell to 3 good friends in recent years and none made it beyond 2 years into retirement , all self employed and to appearances all in good health , a bricklayer , a painter and decorator and a builder . I don't expect to be around any longer than them does this make me lucky or convenient ?

Thanks for brightening my day Shayne, it didn't start very well, and it hasn't got much better...

I've got 2 and a half years to retirement, + 2 years (according to your statistical analysis) = 4 and a half years. If I divide my pot by 4.5 instead of the modest number that I had hoped for, it certainly looks better... I think it will run to a few hob-nobs with the coffee .

Trust me guys, getting older is not a lot of fun, take a tip from me and stay as you are

 

[Pumpy]

Using Robs link, 75 per week = 3900 annual, use 3900 as the priciple sum with 3900 p.a. addition, and 48 years at 9.5% (the average BOE base rate 1975-2009) making additions at the end of the compounding period, I get 3,463,502.06

I must be doing it wrong

 

[Shayne]

Thanks for brightening my day Shayne, it didn't start very well, and it hasn't got much better...

I've got 2 and a half years to retirement, + 2 years (according to your statistical analysis) = 4 and a half years. If I divide my pot by 4.5 instead of the modest number that I had hoped for, it certainly looks better... I think it will run to a few hob-nobs with the coffee .

Trust me guys, getting older is not a lot of fun, take a tip from me and stay as you are

Don't worry Clive 2 were divorced and the other widowed so maybe nagging is a preservative .
No need to worry about pensions either as having read Rob's explanation i now feel confident PM'S past and present will all use their private jets to visit a privately owned island to discuss the problem with a small group of even wealthier chums and decide while drinking the most expensive alcohol and smoking the best cigars that as it was all paid for by the tax payer the only decent thing to do is to put some money back in the pot if they want to go to heaven

 

[clivehorridge]

Don't worry Clive 2 were divorced and the other widowed so maybe nagging is a preservative .
No need to worry about pensions either as having read Rob's explanation i now feel confident PM'S past and present will all use their private jets to visit a privately owned island to discuss the problem with a small group of even wealthier chums and decide while drinking the most expensive alcohol and smoking the best cigars that as it was all paid for by the tax payer the only decent thing to do is to put some money back in the pot if they want to go to heaven

Ah, well that's OK then Shayne

For the record, I've been single, I've been divorced, I've co-habited and now I'm well and truly quite happily married to the right gal (don't tell her that though ) so I'm not sure whether all this is a good thing or not!

 

[Rob Cowell]

Using Robs link, 75 per week = 3900 annual, use 3900 as the priciple sum with 3900 p.a. addition, and 48 years at 9.5% (the average BOE base rate 1975-2009) making additions at the end of the compounding period, I get 3,463,502.06

I must be doing it wrong

Yeah. The assuming £75/week 48 years ago You have to adjust the addition and principle figures.
It'll still come out at what looks like many years of state pension. But NI isn't a pension fund for you. NI is a fund to pay other pensioners while you are working. It relies on having lots of tax paying workers when you want to draw your pension. It's a legal ponzi scheme.

 

[clivehorridge]

Well, if folks live to 85, there's 20 years of £527.52 per month to pay out = £126,604.80 for the government to find from somewhere...

 

[Pat]

Clive,don't worry about aging,I'm78 now and have the odd hiccup but still enjoy life and am keeping on working because I enjoy it,so life is still fun.Cheers Pat

 

[Pat]

And you don't lose your sex drive.

 

[clivehorridge]

And you don't lose your sex drive.

Took care of that Pat, marrying a girl 18 years my junior.... as long as she doesn't lose hers

 

[Graham]

You talk a lot of sense there Rob, but I don't agree with some of it though, for instance refugees and migrants are a problem, they are using up facilities and finance that could be used for needy people in this country, I am a great believer in charity begins at home.
Plus many people in this country are afraid of the terrorists that may be among those refugees coming into this country.

Rather than take a NIMBY view of problems, what are the solutions to millions of people displaced by conflict? I think there is an overall consensus on this forum at least that accomodating people in Europe can or is giving rise to many problems. So what is an alternative approach that helps millions of displaced Syrians, as well as countless other people from coutries to the East of Syria living in nations destabilised by American, European and Saudi policy?

I think most large problems do not have perfect solutions. We have to find the least imperfect one.

It's a side issue but one raised several times here about the EU. Lots of people in the UK don't seem to be very fond of it. But most people in the UK can't remember Europe without the EU. I watched an interview with a World War 2 veteran a few years ago. He didn't like the EU either. Didn't like the erosion of British sovereignty. But he pointed out he would put up with a lot of erosion if it meant his grand children or great grand children didn't have to watch their friends die in another European war. The EU was an American sponsored institution to stabilise Europe whose track record of not falling apart and trying to destroy and subsume each other wasn't good in the few hundred years prior to its formation. You can believe strongly that the EU is a bad thing but with any view or decision the tricky bit is to think ahead and imagine the alternatives.

Right now I think Russia are probably doing what is needed to bring stability to Syria. They seem to be attacking Assad's opponents. Some of whom are ISIL, some of whom are not. Western governments will throw their hands up and say Russia are killing those who have a legitimate right to oppose Assad. But what they really fear is a another Russian aligned state. It's a massively imperfect solution, and in the short term may only add to the refugee and migrant crisis. In the long term it may further increase tension between Europe and Russia.

The one thing I don't think will help the situation though is vilifying the people that are trying to better their lives and moving from where their homes were. That is exactly the sort of mentality that for example, UK Conservatives applaud. Even if none of them has been brave enough to say it since Norman Tebbitt. Refugees and migrants aren't a problem, they are human beings displaced by problems.

No answers. Just my 2p.

Sorry Rob.

Not much I agree with you on there.
Looks like your a supporter of letting them all flock to UK ?

 

[Graham]

It is without doubt religion is the root of all evil.

If I had my way practising ANY religion would carry the death penalty, there is no place for it in today's modern world.

All it seems to do is create disharmony, destruction and death.

Totally agree.

Religion is the root of all evil in one way or another.

Should be banned.
No place for it any more.

Every one seems to be killing or trying to convert some one else from one imaginary god to another imaginary god.

Fecking stupid in my book