Roughtrax front axle refurb kit?

[pberrey]

Does anyone have anything good or bad to say about this kit? What appeals to me is that it's a full kit as it's not a job I want to start and then wait for a week if I've missed a vital seal or bearing. Koyo bearings seem as good as anything I've seen.

http://www.roughtrax4x4.com/?doc=16&cid=1078&vid=2234

DescriptionSuperior quality components make up this complete front hub & swivel overhaul kit from Australian manufacturer Terrain Tamer using Koyo bearings.
Kit Contains;
x4 KOYO swivel bearings
x2 Swivel seal kits (felt/rubber/steel seals & retainers)
x2 Stub axle dust seals
x1 Shim kit (both sides)
x2 Inner axle seals
x2 Main front hub seals
x2 Free wheeling hub gaskets
x4 Front main hub gaskets
x2 Locking tabs

Use one tub of CV grease each side. To make the job easier use our 54mm extended box spanner.

Fits Models: 80 Series - HDJ80, HDJ81, HZJ81, FZJ80 & FJ80.

Price
£95.00 ex VAT
£114.00 inc VAT

Cheers
Paul


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[Dave2000]

Just a couple of things that come to mind, the axle seals are a known weakness IME, I would find out if the seal is OE. The OE seal has a centre that 'floats' and moves within the seal body, every copy I have seen has the typical oil seal with little or no movement and these tend to leak. When I overhaul my axle (or a customers) I will use the Marlin Crawler double lip seal apparently waaaaay superior to anything else out there, if I cannot get the MC I will only use OE.

Second I would order a couple of stub axle bushes, there are often worn and you will not know about it until you have it apart, you might want to check out the version that has needle rollers, seems to be the latest thing, if they are any better than OE I do not know, one thing I do know is the copies (non needle type) sometimes come up undersize and need to be reamed out to suit the CV you have fitted depending if it is a copy or not.

It does seem there are kits everywhere, and each and everyone IME has at least one part that is weak/poor quality or of poor design included, sometimes it is just that one bad part that a supplier has compromised on gets them a bad name, add to this that the fitment of poor quality parts put's your LC into the 'constantly has something wrong' scenario.

I am sure someone else can add to these thoughts?


regards

Dave

 

[iceman]

Paul,

I've had one lately is good stuff - a well known OZ supplier (See - http://www.landcruiserclub.net/forums/showthread.php/53522-whats-your-opinion-on-this-kit)

 

[pberrey]

Thanks gents, great advice.

Iceman your thread seems have have some support for this kit with a few people calling out the wiper seals as per Dave2k.

I've got a 54mm socket and wheel bearings so I think I will go with the kit and get some oem seals and stub axle bushes. If I buy bits myself I am bound to miss something.


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[iceman]

Paul you a part number for that inner seal by any chance - save me some time?

 

[StarCruiser]

 

[iceman]

Ta Star

 

[Knucklehead]

When I overhaul my axle (or a customers) I will use the Marlin Crawler double lip seal apparently waaaaay superior to anything else out there, if I cannot get the MC I will only use OE.

Dave

I'm not so sure about the Marlin seals.
I have a pair sitting around that I never fitted due to the reports in the US of them not being suitable for our full time 4wd.
They are meant to help with the grooves in the half shafts but the solid securing ring is not up to the job like the spring on the OE seals.
Seams a few folk have had to do the rebuild again soon after.
i.e. http://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/do-not-buy-marlin-crawler-inner-axle-seals.760280/

Was tempted to fit and see what happened but such a messy SOB job I went OE last time.
Maybe somebody has had better luck with them.

Dave.

 

[Dave2000]

Read through the thread Dave and there is the obvious for and against arguments. I think the final posters comment that if no wear groove go OE may be pertinent. Interesting is that I fitted OE on both sides of mine and both leaked in a very short time, I changed it for another set of OE and no problem, so I have little choice than to say it was an installation error on the first time around.

Of note is when you read through threads of various posters you get an insight into their different personal circumstances and perhaps more importantly their jobs. It is not uncommon to find that those who had problems doing 'x' job on their car that they have little or no experience working with/on vehicles. You end up with an install error the axle seal being a prime example, and the product gets a slagging. It would be interesting if you asked everyone who had problems with the seals leaking and find out how many actually trained as a mechanic.

My own install is an example IMO of a mechanic making an error on the install, trained for years and have made my fair share of mistakes but TBH when I looked I could not see any reason for my own OE install to leak, the seal was square with the housing, very minor groove in the axle, spring still in place, no 'nicks' and they leaked, and yet the replacement didn't? I could call bad OE seals but that would not fair to Mr T, something I did was not right, the only reason and worthy of note is the possibility that the seal was not sitting in the wear groove properly, the rotation of the axle then acts as a screw and the oils is literally led out of the axle, this would explain may other posters complaining of a leak within a very short time. The axle shaft does 'float' and I think unless the seal is 100% perfectly in line with the wear groove it leaks, the Marlin versions are supposedly to sit further in past the OE wear groove so sitting on virgin metal?

Sorry to the OP as this has drifted a little but if nothing else it is informative, if in any doubt go OE

regards

Dave

 

[Knucklehead]

Yeah Dave, I was so tempted to try these seals last time did rebuild and might just give them a shot next time.
I think the double lip is designed to help with the groove problems. At least one of the lips should be running on unworn metal.

What I really liked about them is the oversized flat section that sits against the axle opening and would stop any crooked installs:


Anyhow, just for info I found the axle kit from Marlin to be great quality.

Dave.

 

[StarCruiser]

I would say from my experience of motor shafts that if there is any significant wear groove to a shaft that that will almost certainly leak. Best to get the groove metal sprayed and ground back to original size. Anything else is a gamble IMO.

Fortunately after 125k mikes mine are not grooved at all.

 

[Knucklehead]

Bit away from the original thread but..

when I rebuilt my axle several years ago now I ended up putting in new half shafts due to the grooves in them @169K.
I looked at using speedi-sleeves and also getting the old axles re-engineered but decided to bite the bullet.

Anyhow, another option I looked at for inner seals was https://www.trail-gear.com/TG/Trail...r_/i_0_0_3545/_140325-1-KIT.aspx#.VPhROvk0xqN who are similar to Marlin except that they use a OE type spring.

There used to be a video posted there describing why the Marlin seals were not oil tight. Can still see the pictures were they compare with the Marlin seals.

Possibly another option for anybody with worn half shafts who don't want the expense of replacement. Although if badly worn then even these double lip seals may not help.

Dave.

 

[pberrey]

For the record I went with the Terrain Tamer kit from Roughtrax and everything went on nicely. There was some wear on the shafts at 181k but nothing that is likely to cause a leak. The king pin bearings looked bronze they were so rusty!

Paul.

 

[Brett]

Was tempted to fit and see what happened but such a messy SOB job I went OE last time.
Maybe somebody has had better luck with them.

Dave.

I've used the Marlin seals, my shafts were pretty grooved on the seal lands to the point where I was considering speedi sleeves or new shafts. I already had the seals and had read the horror stories about them but decided to take a punt and they've been fine.