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The corona virus thread

Has any country got the management of it 100% right? No
Have some done better than others? Yes
Did some act quicker, rather than reacting later? Yes
Are there things that places would do differently? Yes
Could the messaging be better? Yes

Instead of throwing sh!t at one another like a bunch of monkeys, it's really time to reflect on what has worked and what hasn't, because as many have said, this is not going to be the last time that this sort of thing happens.

So, from what I can see in Australia
-Australia shut borders quickly and enforced 14 day quarantine rules but didn't get it right with the cruise ships
-I'm going to hypothesize that the nursing home outbreak and the abatoir outbreak (after the cruise ships, these are our biggest clusters) were due to those not having any job security (casual workers) still coming into work whilst unwell because they didn't fit into the residency statuses that got the financial aid or didn't have any sick leave
-There are mixed messages between Federal and State parliaments, with different rules applying in different States (we get more social mixing from Friday in NSW, but that already changed in some of the other states who reacted quicker to the Federal change)

And in the UK:
-Borders weren't shut until recently/quarantine (not self, but "you are going into quarantine" type rules)
-Messages are mess - Boris/Westminster is wanting one thing, the Scots and the Welsh are wanting another

We won't mention the USA....



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I've just been chatting with a mate back in the UK - she had a little lad at the end of February, and as her husband is a paramedic he hasn't been able to be involved in anything as he's living at their house in isolation with the dog, and she's at her parent's house....
 
-I'm going to hypothesize that the nursing home outbreak and the abatoir outbreak (after the cruise ships, these are our biggest clusters) were due to those not having any job security (casual workers)

An interesting point Ed ,we have a similar situation here in Spain with major outbreaks in nursing homes & one in the biggest abattoir in the country.Even before the COVID crisis precarious employment meant that people here couldn't afford to be sick - instant sack in many low skilled jobs.

it's really time to reflect on what has worked and what hasn't, because as many have said, this is not going to be the last time that this sort of thing happens.
Better employment protection so workers can go on the sick without fear or financial penalty ?

This opinion gives an idea of a possible way forward .

Did some act quicker, rather than reacting later? Yes

South Korea it would seem has learnt some lessons from the H1N1 & previous SARS outbreaks.

Also a correlation has been made between epicentres of the outbreak and pollution , especially PM 10. The Po Valley in Italy is supposedly the most polluted region of Europe & Madrid & Barcelona have had the highest numbers of cases .
IMO this isn't a binary choice of economy vs deaths , there is nuance & room for manoeuvre.
Perhaps we can learn some lessons ?
 
Who'd have thought that a virus that attacks via the respiratory system might be worse in places with high levels of pollution that damages the respiratory system? its not rocket science just simple biological science :lol:

The 5G brigade clearly aren't bright enough to know the difference between a virus and a computer virus, but it must be true David Icke said it was.
 
I lost my grandad to this virus about a month ago, it's his funeral on Thursday, I'm aloud to go now that 10 people can attend.

I just can't get to grips that this came from bats, people have been eating them and experimenting with the virus's they produce for years, I read somewhere about the pangolin that are traded in wuhan, that could have picked up the virus and that been passed to humans.

But even so, pangolins are th most traded animal in china, and I think there pretty high up in the world, so how after all this time this happens I don't understand, why now?

I understand there's been other outbreaks and deaths but nothing to this extent that spread to all corners of the globe.

something my snap on dealer asked me I thought about a fair bit and asked others, do you think this is a one off? Or do you think this could become a more regular occurrence, 30k plus deaths in the U.K. Now, I really hope it isn't.

I hope everyone is staying safe and we can all go back to normal very soon.
 
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I lost my grandad to this virus about a month ago, it's his funeral on Thursday, I'm aloud to go now that 10 people can attend.

I just can't get to grips that this came from bats, people have been eating them and experimenting with the virus's they produce for years, I read somewhere about the pangolin that are traded in wuhan, that could have picked up the virus and that been passed to humans.

But even so, pangolins are th most traded animal in china, and I think there pretty high up in the world, so how after all this time this happens I don't understand, why now?

I understand there's been other outbreaks and deaths but nothing to this extent that spread to all corners of the globe.

something my snap on dealer asked me I thought about a fair bit and asked others, do you think this is a one off? Or do you think this could become a more regular occurrence, 30k plus deaths in the U.K. Now, I really hope it isn't.

I hope everyone is staying safe and we can all go back to normal very soon.
So sorry to hear about you Grandad, one of many :-(
 
From what i gather the virus in bats and several other creatures has been known about for a long time but it was harmless to humans , so they are trying to trace the exact source of this particular strain because if they knew how it evolved into a human virus they could reproduce and breakdown the process perhaps revealing a way to reverse the mutation . A cure is better than a vaccine .

Sorry to hear about your grandad .
 
Has any country got the management of it 100% right? No
Have some done better than others? Yes
Did some act quicker, rather than reacting later? Yes
Are there things that places would do differently? Yes
Could the messaging be better? Yes

Instead of throwing sh!t at one another like a bunch of monkeys, it's really time to reflect on what has worked and what hasn't, because as many have said, this is not going to be the last time that this sort of thing happens.

So, from what I can see in Australia
-Australia shut borders quickly and enforced 14 day quarantine rules but didn't get it right with the cruise ships
-I'm going to hypothesize that the nursing home outbreak and the abatoir outbreak (after the cruise ships, these are our biggest clusters) were due to those not having any job security (casual workers) still coming into work whilst unwell because they didn't fit into the residency statuses that got the financial aid or didn't have any sick leave
-There are mixed messages between Federal and State parliaments, with different rules applying in different States (we get more social mixing from Friday in NSW, but that already changed in some of the other states who reacted quicker to the Federal change)

And in the UK:
-Borders weren't shut until recently/quarantine (not self, but "you are going into quarantine" type rules)
-Messages are mess - Boris/Westminster is wanting one thing, the Scots and the Welsh are wanting another

We won't mention the USA....



--------

I've just been chatting with a mate back in the UK - she had a little lad at the end of February, and as her husband is a paramedic he hasn't been able to be involved in anything as he's living at their house in isolation with the dog, and she's at her parent's house....
:text-goodpost::clap:
 
Who'd have thought that a virus that attacks via the respiratory system might be worse in places with high levels of pollution that damages the respiratory system? its not rocket science just simple biological science :lol:

The 5G brigade clearly aren't bright enough to know the difference between a virus and a computer virus, but it must be true David Icke said it was.
:text-goodpost::clap:
 
Took advantage of the latest lockdown rules today and went out for a run on the bike. Noticeably more traffic around but nothing like pre-lockdown levels. Quite a few other bikes out and a few horse riders and hill walkers (I was on the dirtbike). I honestly expected to see some “keep away” signage in the Peak District and maybe a locked gate or two but all looked normal apart from the people numbers. Never seen Castleton as deserted which figures as most people go there for the souvenir shops and pubs/cafes which are all closed. Only saw one Police car just after leaving home. They still have powers to challenge and fine lockdown breakers for some infringements but I think their job has been made almost impossible overnight.
 
Helen's friend was buried today and so she walked up just to be on route to pay her respects . Apparently from the deceased home to the to the crematorium the streets were lined with people and it was the most memorable send off she ever witnessed . The hearse followed a walking funeral director while the cars behind played her favourite music , people were clapping . A bus coming the opposite way pulled over the driver removed his cap and let two passenger dismount to bow their heads in respect and the next four cars in Helen's view got out to do the same . Obviously she didn't see it all as i'd guess the its a little over 2 miles to the crem but doesn't it make you wonder how the world has changed in such a short period of time . The oncoming vehicles very likely had no idea who's funeral it was and may have been surprised to learn Terry was just a single mother 58 years old in a town of 50,000 or so people .

She died following an operation to remove cancer , both her parents and her younger sister died young of cancer yet the official cause of death is covid19 , doesn't that make you wonder as well .
 
I see the WHO are now saying, “Covid 19 may never go away”. Well of course not, why would it? Wiping out every single trace of the organism is impossible, even TB and Smallpox are still around in some countries. All we can hope for is to reduce or prevent deaths from Covid with drugs and a vaccine, possible and probable, it’s just the timescale no one knows for sure.
 
yeah a lot more people, noise and traffic about. apart from the obvious i was enjoying this "new" way of life.. i went down to devon last week with the trailer, i put the cruise control on once i got on the motorway and didnt have to knock it off until leaving it. heaven.

my sister tested positive a couple of days ago. fingers crossed she seems to be one of the ones with light symptoms.
 
My wife has no sense of taste, smell, a persistent dry cough and shortness of breath. Her doc sent her for a Covid test. Results came back in just over a day.
Told us what we already knew. She's had those symptoms for 20 years. But the doc was insistent that she went for a test. Problem is, if she does get it, how will we know? But at least the testing worked. 50 mile round trip when there is a testing station 5 miles away. We drove past it the other day. Not a soul there.
 
I see the WHO are now saying, “Covid 19 may never go away”. Well of course not, why would it? Wiping out every single trace of the organism is impossible, even TB and Smallpox are still around in some countries. All we can hope for is to reduce or prevent deaths from Covid with drugs and a vaccine, possible and probable, it’s just the timescale no one knows for sure.

It's possible to wipe out a virus. A virus needs a host. If no one has it that's it, it's gone. Smallpox happens to be the best example of that. No one in the world has had smallpox for more than 40 years. It still exists, but only in labs, for reference purposes. That said we haven't wiped out many other viruses.

TB isn't a virus, and is trickier to control.
 
Monday was my first visit to town in the morning for 10 weeks.Afternoons have been quite in a way that's rare in Spain , like new years day.Bur even so it was almost empty for a Monday & folks were being really careful , a lot of masks being worn.
I had a meeting in the local authority offices , my former workplace some years ago & it was full on with a reception committee inside the front door with hand sanitiser gloves & masks laid out & a sighing in procedure. The days of wandering in & seeing who was in their office , stopping by for a chat & a coffee are over for the moment. I had to wait in the lobby & was called up on the dot for my appointment.as i arrived upstairs there was another sanitiser station & inside the office every desk had screens & everyone was wearing a mask. At least on a local level this is being taken really seriously & it seems the vast majority of people are playing their part. There has been a really generous response to the call for food bank donations & folks have stepped up with homemade masks , looking out for their neighbours & a whole host of other civic minded acts. This is the silver lining.
 
I have no medical knowledge so this may not be true but I wouldn't want to take the risk of getting infected with the virus, would you?
trachea.jpg




Written by a nurse who works with ventilators:

"Here you go folks... for those people who don't understand what it means to be on a ventilator but want to take the chance of not ‘staying at home’, not self distancing and going out without a mask...

For starters, it's NOT an oxygen mask put over the mouth while the patient is comfortably lying down and reading magazines. Ventilation for Covid-19 is a painful intubation that goes down your throat and stays there until you live or you die.

It is done under anesthesia for 2 to 3 weeks without moving, often upside down, with a tube inserted from the mouth up to the trachea and allows you to breathe to the rhythm of the lung machine. The patient can't talk or eat, or do anything naturally - the machine keeps you alive.

The discomfort and pain they feel from this means medical experts have to administer sedatives and painkillers to ensure tube tolerance for as long as the machine is needed. It's like being in an artificial coma.

After 20 days from this treatment, a young patient loses 40% muscle mass, and gets mouth or vocal cords trauma, as well as possible pulmonary or heart complications.

It is for this reason that old or already weak people can't withstand the treatment and die. Many of us are in this boat ... so stay safe unless you want to take the chance of ending up here. This is NOT the flu.

Add a tube into your stomach, either through your nose or skin for liquid food, a sticky bag around your butt to collect the diarrhea, a foley catheter to collect urine, an IV for fluids and meds, an A-line f to monitor your BP that is completely dependent upon finely calculated med doses, teams of nurses, CRNA’s and MA’s to reposition your limbs every two hours and lying on a mat that circulates ice cold fluid to help bring down your 104 degree temp.

Anyone want to try all that out? Stay home and wear a mask when you go out! Stay safe and well!"

What this article doesn't say is that the patient can hear everything that is said so if the staff carelessly talks about death, the patient panics. If the sedatives are lessened, the patient panics because he can't breath or talk or, in his case, move. When they begin to lower the pain medications, the patient screams in his head but can't make a sound. When they take out the tubes it's extremely uncomfortable. A trachea may replace the respirator, the patient still can't talk or eat without a tube.
 
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Chas that is brilliant , reminds me of my mother for some reason ? This is exactly the sort of tough love that should have been headlines on day one of lockdown .

Doris find this nurse and make her spokesperson for the chief medical officer and make sure he knows she is getting paid more than him .
 
Things are getting back to normal it would seem if you use food quality as an indicator . Panic buyers gave us the best meat and veg ever but that's all over now :cry:

On the bright side we finally got around to having real milk delivered 89p a pint compared to 50p in a plastic bottle but hey its delivered and its 50% more milk less water .
 
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