Towing in the UK question..

[Bob]

Quick one for those in the know.. Have been asked by a friend to collect a classic car from the Wimbledon area in the next few weeks. I'm aware that it's inside the LEZ so that needs to be paid, but a trustworthy associate questioned whether or not I need a tachograph in the UK. I have towed before through Blighty, and never thought about it, but one of his company Shoguns was impounded last year collecting an agricultural mower. I'm fully licensed and insured for towing.

I reckon it's the business use that got him, as sub 3.5 ton vehicles don't need a tacho in Ireland even if towing. As far as I understood, private use is exempt, but said I would ask... sorry if it's a silly question

 

[fbnss]

I think it's the max train weight that needs the tacho. So for example. 3.5 ton truck towing 3.5 ton truck. I' not sure what the actual figure is though (yes I should know, tut tut)

 

[fbnss]

 

[StarCruiser]

Depends on weights and when you psssed your test. This may help.

https://www.gov.uk/towing-with-car

Not sure about LEZ for non commercial vehicles. I don't think it applies but worth a Google.

 

[Bob]

So I fall under the 'not for hire or reward' exception? Surely if you're heading off with a caravan behind a cruiser on hols, then a tacho is not required??

Rules are different on this rock

 

[Bob]

Depends on weights and when you psssed your test. This may help.

https://www.gov.uk/towing-with-car

Not sure about LEZ for non commercial vehicles. I don't think it applies but worth a Google.

The license isn't a problem as I have a full trailer license. It's a funny one as techinally my cruiser is a commercial vehicle, (converted to a van when new just like 90% if Irish trucks) but not owned or run by any business. I don't mind the LEZ charge, but don't want to have a tricky conversation with a Bobby 300 miles from home!

 

[StarCruiser]

So I fall under the 'not for hire or reward' exception? Surely if you're heading off with a caravan behind a cruiser on hols, then a tacho is not required??

Correct. Usually the weight of the caravan is below the weight limit. I've always thought this to be crazy really as you can tow a heavier trailer with a lighter vehicle within the same gross train weight or MAM as they now call it, which is asking for trouble if you ask me. Still, I suppose HGVs do it all the time with articulated trailers.

 

[fbnss]

So I fall under the 'not for hire or reward' exception?

I think so.

 

[Bob]

Also seems as though the LEZ charge doesn't apply.. only to 4x4s pre 2002.. (Euro 3 emissions). I just don't like being uncertain.. and I'm not fitting a tacho!

 

[mettisse]

Quick one for those in the know.. Have been asked by a friend to collect a classic car from the Wimbledon area in the next few weeks. I'm aware that it's inside the LEZ so that needs to be paid, but a trustworthy associate questioned whether or not I need a tachograph in the UK. I have towed before through Blighty, and never thought about it, but one of his company Shoguns was impounded last year collecting an agricultural mower. I'm fully licensed and insured for towing.

I reckon it's the business use that got him, as sub 3.5 ton vehicles don't need a tacho in Ireland even if towing. As far as I understood, private use is exempt, but said I would ask... sorry if it's a silly question

Hi,you are correct about business use, even then " dual purpose" vehicles are exempt ( ranges discos 80 s etc) NOT pick ups or Transit van type vehicles , I know because it applies to me, I have an operators licence, and I went to a seminar with VOSA and of which this was one of the issues discussed , if you check out with gov websites and the people that run the roads you will find that you do not need a Tacho, you will pay the the congestion charge where it applies and check with Transport for London about the LEZ ( website asks for your reg number) the factor for you is it is NOT business, and your vehicle is dual purpose. But please check it out on the websites first , print out the information and have it with you in the event of a VOSA or police stop, it can happen as it did to a chap I know, the people who stop you may not completely understand the law as it applies today. The chap I know bought a wreck of a Landy series and was towing it home and was subjected to all sorts of grief, and a lot of time wasted, be prepared and be very conscious of secure loading methods, in your minds eye, would the " load" depart from the trailer if it were tipped upside down? That's how secure it has to be, ( from the seminar)
Again do your own research and be pepared to show it to the authorities and if in doubt call the VOSA and ask, we found them to be helpful with a genuine interest in having safe roads, best regards to all, Bill Westley

 

[Bob]

Thanks Bill, very helpful post. Sounds like my gut was right. No worries in relation to load securing, I'm a neurotic pain in the ass when it comes to that! And don't get me started on trailer lights! Good idea on printing the info, I'll get onto the website and find what I need.

 

[StarCruiser]

On printing out the info. I was once stopped and asked what the maximum towing weight was and was told 750kg to which I responded that it was more than that due to the trailer being braked. This prompred the officer to thumb through his manual and eventually let me off that one!

Just make sure you've got a number plate matching the vehicle on the trailer.

 

[mettisse]

Hello again, forgot to say it makes good sense to hide the number of the vehicle on the trailer, it does not need to be shown as once it is on the trailer it now becomes " the load" there are all sorts of cameras that may pick the number up (and you are doing nothing wrong) , however you may get a bill for the vehicle being "on the road" ( no fun) a pal of mine drives for a vehicle recovery firm and it is normal practice to do this. Hope it goes well. From your post it sounds as if you've got it together, have a safe trip, Best regards, Bill Westley

 

[Bob]

Hadn't thought of that, not much number plate recognition here yet, just a couple of tolls. Have moved a lot of stuff on all kinds of trailers and crossed the UK with big trailers before, just the experience my mate had makes me cautious. Thanks for the replies

 

[moggy1968]

You don’t need a tacho unless your in the business of haulage. As a private individual you never need one, otherwise all discover 3s fitted with a tow bar would have to also have a tacho.

 

[Bob]

It makes sense when it's put simply! Similar situation here in a way. We have a bus in work which I drive from time to time, and it is tacho exempt as its not in use for hire or reward. I've questioned it thoroughly but all answers were exempt.

The 3.5 ton thing threw me a bit as it is different here, even for business use. You can have a 3.5ton transit pick up and a 16ft Williams behind it loaded to the same and no tacho needed

 

[Ben Stratford]

. I don't mind the LEZ charge, but don't want to have a tricky conversation with a Bobby 300 miles from home!

Do we still have Bobbies? Havent seen one in years!!

 

[mettisse]

You don’t need a tacho unless your in the business of haulage. As a private individual you never need one, otherwise all discover 3s fitted with a tow bar would have to also have a tacho.

I agree totally with your comment, but the devil is in the detail, any transit type van and any pick up is seen to be commercial in the eyes of VOSA, you have to prove its not business, however what they call dual purpose vehicles ( discos, defenders ( not pick ups) 80s etc are not seen in the same category) when I get time I'll post up their paperwork that they gave me at the seminar, but best is to go on their website, of course anything you do with a trailer (as rightly said) for your own pleasure or leisure does not come under the same rules, and worth noting that I believe Isuzu pick ups come from the factory with wiring provision for a Tacho, I don't know if others do or don't , but it shows the information has been out there .
The transit/ Ifor Williams 3.5 ton bit could be iffy as I believe its EEC law not local, it may be local to not make an issue, but if you ever travel over/ under the Dartford crossing ( ( England not Eire) you will be under the scrutiny of well clued up VOSA , who do know the rules.
I was stopped by the French police near Clermont Ferrand, I had my off Roader on my Ifor Williams. He checked my vin plate on the 80, the plate on the trailer to see if it was ok for the weight, the ratchet straps holding the truck down, all the paperwork for the 80, than asked for the paperwork for the Froader ( which I believe he didn't have grounds for) when he checked my licence he noted that I was an LGV qualified driver, ticked all the boxes on his sheet and bid me a good journey, he new exactly what he was looking for by virtue of his tick sheet, I'm sure it will be the same here, eventually.
Best regards to all, Bill Westley

 

[IRLGW]

if you cant do the time dont do the crime...why not just email the uk police and get a straight answer in writing. The fact that you have extra towing cover might ring alarm bells though as the normal driver doesnt require this. I have seen the traffic police on the A55 use load mats on various setups but not sure if that was aimed at tacho infringements. why not just get it dropped at holyhead and loaded as frieght. Usually no more expensive than driving over and towing back for small load like that

 

[Paddler Ed]

You're picking up a new vehicle for yourself - it was cheaper to buy it in the UK than in Eire.

Don't mention the fact it's for a mate, and if you can get the paperwork easily into your name then it's even better.

I think as soon as you mention it's for a mate, it goes belly up... I think this is what happened to one of the classic car magazines and their Transit van...

VOSA have a comprehensive section it, so worth having a look at that.