What other axle full floating axle will Toyota 6 stud wheels fit ?

[Shayne]

As in Nissan , Mitsu , Volvo , anything ?

 

[Shayne]

One of these must have a full floating rear end i guess .

Chevrolet Blazer	6 x 139.7
Chevrolet Tahoe	6 x 139.7
Ford Explorer	6 x 139.7
Ford Maverick	6 x 139.7
Ford Maverick	6 x 139.7
Isuzu Combi Van	6 x 139.7
Isuzu Midi	6 x 139.7
Isuzu Pick Up	6 x 139.7
Isuzu Trooper	6 x 139.7
Mitsubishi Galopper	6 x 139.7
Mitsubishi L200, L300	6 x 139.7
Mitsubishi Pajero	6 x 139.7
Mitsubishi Shogun	6 x 139.7
Mitsubishi L200, L300	6 x 139.7
Mitsubishi Pajero, Shogun	6 x 139.7
Nissan Pathfinder	6 x 139.7
Nissan Patrol	6 x 139.7
Nissan Patrol	6 x 139.7
Nissan Patrol GR	6 x 139.7
Nissan Pick-Up	6 x 139.7
Nissan Safari	6 x 139.7
Nissan Terrano	6 x 139.7
Nissan Terrano II	6 x 139.7
Nissan Urvan	6 x 139.7
Nissan Terrano 2	6 x 139.7
Nissan Terrano	6 x 139.7
Nissan Patrol, Pathfinder	6 x 139.7
Nissan Patrol GR	6 x 139.7
Opel Bedford KTS/Campo	6 x 139.7
Opel Frontera	6 x 139.7
Opel Monterey	6 x 139.7
Ssang Yong Korando	6 x 139.7
Ssang Yong Musso	6 x 139.7
Toyota Hi-Ace 4x4	6 x 139.7
Toyota Hi-Lux	6 x 139.7
Toyota Land Cruiser	6 x 139.7
Volkswagen Taro 4x4	6 x 139.7

 

[Iwan]

I am wondering what you wish to achieve here Shayne? Full floating rear axles are bloody expensive.

Surely you could use front stub axles with the bearing hubs and bolt them to your existing backing plates possibly?

Just possibly an easier approach.

 

[Shayne]

Perhaps i could if i knew anything about them Iwan but i don't . I've given up on finding a pro that can help so whatever i do i will have to do myself . The Rapier trailer only has stub axles and suspension is dealt with by a rubber bumpstop . I found nearby a very cheap Surf axle and thought to myself there you go just chop the ends off and weld them on , so i've been up since 4.30am working out why it wont work , nothing i want ever does unless i'm doing it for someone else

 

[Iwan]

I have a set of mk5 hilux fronts here

As they strip back there's a stub axle bolted to the hub carrier. Which possibly could be bolted to your trailer axle. I mean to take the drive shaft off and can investigate further for you to see if there's a chance of them to be adapted to your application. Just a thought

 

[Shayne]

Much appreciated mate let me investigate more before you go to any trouble , i'm trying to achieve 3 things at once a wider track - brakes - and Toyota wheels , the surf axle would give me all 3 if i could remove the shaft and keep the hub trouble is i'm the hands on kind so diagrams and measurements just frustrate me , if i had a pile of bits in front of me i'm sure i could work something out .

 

[Julian T]

Shayne, if you strip one of your trailers hubs and check the bearings inner diameter and do the same for a 6 stud hub bearing outer diameter then it might be possible to match up a set of bearings that will allow you to mount a 6 stud hub on the rapier stub axles, just need to check that the inner and outer bearing positions match closely enough that the retaining nuts etc will secure everything.

Could a collie rear axle set up be modified to mount to your trailers suspension?
I ask because I think that a 80 series rear axle could very easily be turned into a trailer axle, especially if the donor axle was a drum brake set up.

As an aside I have often contemplated building a overland trailer with independent suspension for ground clearance that would utilize Lc 80 front stub axles and hubs less the swivel housing but with disc and calliper, because then I would have a matching set of spares that would be relatively easy to source, and in a roadside emergency replacement parts to get me out of trouble, having said that front stub axles and hubs are the last thing I would expect to give me grief, bearings perhaps.

Just some ideas that you have probably already thought of, or not.
I understand your frustration after all the times I have had trying to make a plan to get something to work in a way it was not designed to.
Farmers make a plan, especially in the old days in the Zulu land bush

 

[Paddler Ed]

What about these? Or am I heading in the wrong direction?

The only issue with running other makes is that the centre bore is sometimes off, but that isn't too bad from what I understand with the Japanese 6 stud hubs - there are some peculiarities, but normally smaller than a Toyota centre bore rather than larger.

 

[Shayne]

It would be nice if that was all i needed Ed but this is more like it

I see what you mean about bolting a front hub on now Iwan i would probably have a better chance of getting an adapter made for that than the wheel , but again that would put me at the mercy of the pro's and i don't have time for that . I would settle for off the shelf landrover parts if the UNF imperial sizing didn't mean buy it and see if it fits wasn't my only option .

 

[stumog]

Could you get your drums welded up the redrilled with the correct pcd? If sankey drums are the same I have a spare set if you want to try.
Stu

 

[Shayne]

Its more a question of whats feasible given my lack of experience and suitable tools rather than whats possible Stu . Instinct keeps leading me back to the Surf rear axle

Looking at the pic above the shaft is held in place by a snap ring and retainer of some sort , i presume these must sit against something inside the axle housing . So lets say i remove everything from the housing then cut out the section designed to receive the retainer (maybe 2 or 3 inches) . Then cut off the hub end of the axle 2 or 3 inches shorter than i want it to be . Then weld the retaining lip pipe to the axle end leaving me with a stub braked axle housing . Then i could take the shaft to a local workshop and say with my normal impeccable way of explaining myself see that bit there where the snap ring and retainer go - well i need it down there so i can chop the rest of the shaft off .

Does that make any sense or am i talking in riddles again ?

 

[stumog]

If you don't know I think I would leave it standard as you are going to end up chucking money down the drain. This is even more fundamental work with lots to go wrong. I am a firm believer that anything mod have made is strong as hell and is the best that you can get for a open cheque book so why do you want to change it so bad? I do see the point to some extent of wheels with the same stud pattern but you will still have to carry the same amount of spares. I dont see why you are worried about the track so much when you will be likely to be driving tracks that were made by landrovers so the trailer will still run in the ruts you will encounter.

Most people use a sankey as it's alot easier to have a beam axle made to what you want. Could you have a axle made to the correct specs you want and then have leaf springs fitted to the trailer and get away from the heavy standard stuff that's on it?

What you are trying to do is the kind of work that someone that is good at fabrication would do at home but would touch for a paying customer as there would be lots of comebacks if it all goes tits up.

Stu

 

[Shayne]

I found someone to make wheel adapters , we have discussed by phone the need to make either new axle studs or nuts that will fit the original studs though it was decided we should put that on hold until he can take a look at the PCD's involved . He replied by email 400 quid is the initial quote and i replied asking if that was all in . No reply as yet but I expect not . The new canvas i want is going to cost me upwards of 1200 so i feel hard of butchering the tub it will attach to . There is no cheap route to what i want and i accept that , but i do struggle with paying for things that are vaguely sort of kind of similar to but not at all what i want .

With regards to strength the finished trailer will permanently be limited to carrying perhaps half the weight for which it was designed for so i'm not overly concerned about that . Fair point about comebacks for fabricators though i hadn't really considered that .

 

[stumog]

I found someone to make wheel adapters , we have discussed by phone the need to make either new axle studs or nuts that will fit the original studs though it was decided we should put that on hold until he can take a look at the PCD's involved .

He replied by email 400 quid is the initial quote and i replied asking if that was all in . No reply as yet but I expect not . The new canvas i want is going to cost me upwards of 1200 so i feel hard of butchering the tub it will attach to




. There is no cheap route to what i want and i accept that , but i do struggle with paying for things that are vaguely sort of kind of similar to but not at all what i want .

With regards to strength the finished trailer will permanently be limited to carrying perhaps half the weight for which it was designed for so i'm not overly concerned about that . Fair point about comebacks for fabricators though i hadn't really considered that .

with regard to butchering the tub this is not what i had in mind. the triler tub is mounted to a chassis so you would be modifying the chassis not the tub so that would not be harmed.

its not all about the weight that the trailer will carry i understand its not going to be carring the 1ton of missles it used to but you are going to be adding what 50mm each side to the spacers so that is alot of extra loading on the wheelbearings just to start with no plus it all has to be dont very well as you could be mile after mile of washboard roads or mountain tracks that will break all kinds of add ons as you drive. you could end up using the trailer harder then the mod would have done.

what is the thinking on the track as i am interested on you thoughts on that please.

stu

 

[clivehorridge]

For what it's worth, I would want to avoid using a ff rear axle without the shafts in, I'm sure they take a lot of load off the wheel bearings, but I'm only guessing.

I ran a trailer for 10 years with a full rear axle including the diff! Heavy it was, but I gave that thing some unmercifull punishment (obscene overloading, you name it) and it worked flawlessly until it was nicked

 

[Shayne]

What led me to full floating is the definition of it , of course i'm only learning these things now but as i understand it the FF axle is better and stronger because it has one bearing to carry the vehicle weight and another to support the shaft under drive as opposed to one bearing dealing with both jobs though i'm happy to be corrected .

With regards to track Stu if i was building from scratch it would be identical to the track on my truck . I get what your saying about following Landrover trails but LR's do tend to have skinnier tyres than ours so when the ground is hard and dry my trailer would shimmy along half in and half out of the ruts , but when its wet i would like the trailer following in my tracks hopefully reducing drag .

Funny thing is from a purely practical point of view i think the skinny tyres the MOD use are ideal for trailers because if your going into uncharted territory you want the wheels to dig . Imagine trying to descend a sand dune in the Sahara at a 45 degree angle , i wouldn't want fat tyres that would allow the trailer to go sideways then . But hey fat tyres look good and i'm not planning on invading any sandy countries in the foreseeable future .

Widening the chassis is the best option as the suspension on these is fixed , i pondered on this for a while but the way its put together i think the work involved wouldn't fall far short of building a duplicate .

 

[stumog]

Your trailer wouldnt be shimmying along as there is not that much difference in the tracks as it is, your Cruiser would be towards the outer of the ruts and the trailer would be on the inside of the rutts but wouldnt be in one rut and out of the other. If you in dry ground then you would be making ruts as you travel along as the ground would be hard.If you like to come over to me there is a great lane that would demonstrate this and i think you would then see what i mean. If your in boggy conditions i expec you will be winching out and you shouldnt have gone in the first place with a trailer.

you resoning on skinny tyres is a bit false aswell. here is my thought........

if you have skinny tyres on your trailer you will reduce your drag on hard ground and highway use as there is less surface area in contact with the floor. If you have wider tyres the trailer is more likely to float over the top of soft mud/sand so would be less likely to drag you in and get you stuck ( so i see why wide tyres are needed). if your in the sand you want wide tyres so you dig in less.

I do agree that the fat tyres look great. If you look at what Rich sims has done he has gone for Standard wolf rims with the same tyres he is running on the car so if worst case he is down to one spare wheel left he could just take the tyre of the rim and fit to the cruiser or trailer which ever is needed. will you fit the 285 on to the trailer with the normal rims or do they rub? if they rub you could try more offset rims.

I am just trying to get you to think about what your trying to achieve for what you are putting in. I really think the amount of work to change the track and stud pattern is such a large under taking to get a small benafit out of it would make the job a no winner.

Please can you pop over the bridge with cruiser and trailer and i will show you how capable the set up will be. If you do it will save you so much grief and you can then sort out the rest of the trailer as you will stop worring about the wheels.

Please dont take my comments as being nasty i really just want to help you get A sorted and B not spend as much as you have on other things you cant use.

all the best Stu

 

[Shayne]

My trouble has always been that i have a tendency to decide what i want long before trying to discover whether or not it actually exists . I'm glad of your comments Stu as discussion helps me think , that's another problem i have and the reason i talk so much crap on here i spend 95% of my time entirely alone and i have nobody at all i can bounce ideas off . Stranger in a strange land syndrome , back home most of my family are running around in trucks on there third or forth engine and still moaning because the last one cost them 50 quid fitted and only lasted 5 years without maintenance

I have no doubts about what the trailer is capable of its got 2ft of ground clearance . I would leave the standard wheels on it but the tub won't fit between them . I can't get LR wheels with sufficient offset which made me think what the hell if i have to start buying things i may as well have matching wheels and tyres .

Where its all gone pear shaped is it never occurred to me that getting wheel adapters might prove a problem , others have done it so its not like i was trying to rewrite the bible . A couple of sellers confirmed they could do the adapters but there would be a long wait then i finds a guy who says no problem i have all the measurement i need on my database 10 days £200 .

That was over 2 months ago , you have seen the spacers that arrived and i can't fit them anyway because the nuts are the wrong thread size . Now times running out and i just want the tub on so i can whack some mudguards on it and say it'll do . I wanted to do it once and do it right but that's not gonna happen now .

 

[AndycruiserguyLomas]

A fully floating axle supports all the load on the axle case. the shaft has no supporting load on it at all. in fact it would be advantageous to remove the shafts and diff, blanking them off and save a lot of unsprung weight.

Andy

 

[Paddler Ed]

Shayne,

What about getting some LR wheels rebanded? It's a trick I know of from the other car world I live in (Volvos...) where they can't always get what they want either; for example this place is £110 for 2 16" wheels rebanded, or there's this place

I have no experience of any of these, but it's just ideas... Searching for wheel rebanding puts you into some strange worlds...