why

[Jeremy L-Jones]

Sorry, I don't understand why only administrators are the only ones able to advertise...?

I see why you don't want the forum swamped, but this seems a little Orwellian to me.

Just a thought.

Jeremy

 

[Crispin]

What makes you say only admins are the only ones advertising?
The classified section, ebay addicts and for sale are full of ads from other people.

 

[Rob]

I think Jeremy is referring to this rule

17. Advertising in signatures
Only the moderation team will be permitted to display advertisements within their personal signatures. These advertisements shall be at the discretion of the particular moderator/administrator. Any advertisements displayed within the signatures of general members shall be removed without notice and repeats of displaying advertisements within signatures shall result in official warnings.

 

[Andrew Prince]

Hmm Jeremy you do have a point - the rules/guidelines were borrowed from a similar club as a template for ours. Some parts like that got in below the radar. Sorry! One of the cornerstones of this new site and the merger with ELCO was to avoid unequal treatment of any members and especially to avoid high-handed actions from the modmins on the site

For sure the inclusion of that inappropriate rule is our mistake as mods and there is NO intention from any of the mods/admin folk to benefit financially from this site using any format or mechanism that is not open to all other members of the club.

I hope I'm not speaking out of turn and putting words into Crispin's mouth but I am pretty sure we can and will remove the first sentence of that rule. I do think that we as a club should reserve the right to allow advertising in signatures, simply to prevent abuse of the forum. Not saying people can't advertise but this privilege can be withdrawn (with good reason and with an explanation).

We do have sections where people can advertise their goods and services, even commercials ones. As long as people are clear on their position so that members can make informed choices, there is no need for any draconian enforcement by the mod team.

Cheers,

 

[Chris]

But, surely there is a difference between an advert and advertising (bear with me on the semantics). Adverts for sale for example, go in the for sale section but advertising such as banners etc for services, companies, appeals etc are different - yes? I for one do not want to see signatures becoming even larger with banners for things especially those unrelated to Land Cruiser ownership or the forum. If I look at the for sale sections, I am making a choice but to have advertising thrust at me during normal topics would be unwelcome in my personal view. Easier just not to allow adverts or advertising in any signature?

Chris

 

[Andrew Prince]

Fair point, Chris, and I don't disagree with you!

I'm not aware that anyone is advertising in their signature and we've only had one truly commercial member (Opie Oils) that has been active, that I can recall anyway. So there's nothing "broke" at present, other than a rule that could use some tweaking to ensure that it reflects what we as club want.

 

[Chris]

Is Gav's custom fabs an advert Andrew?

Only kidding. Seriously. I've had a bashing today so it's my turn.

Chris

 

[Crispin]

Like Andrew said, we did not read them all

If there is a commercial advert in someone's sig, i.e "Have a look at my shop at www. that's not on. There is a commercial section for stuff like that.
This would be do everyone, not just users or admins.

I see no harm in "Wildsmith's sliders" or "Gav's bash plates". I relish the day I can add "Gav's customer bash plates for a 120" in my sig

 

[Paul]

 

[Jeremy L-Jones]

I think Jeremy is referring to this rule

17. Advertising in signatures
Only the moderation team will be permitted to display advertisements within their personal signatures. These advertisements shall be at the discretion of the particular moderator/administrator. Any advertisements displayed within the signatures of general members shall be removed without notice and repeats of displaying advertisements within signatures shall result in official warnings.

Yes, sorry, didn't make it clear enough. I appreciate that there are places to put ads up but to say only moderators can advertise in signatures is truly Orwellian to me. You know what I mean, we're all equal but some of us are more equal than others etc.

Maybe it should be a blanket rule to cover everyone...?

It's no big deal really but I'm all for as flat a hierarchy as possible.

IMHO of course

 

[Paul]

I know i ahve had quite a bit to drink tonight, but is this simon in disguise having a pop at us?

 

[Jeremy L-Jones]

If you're referring to me... err... no... just asking a question if that's ok.

 

[Graham]

Well, Im'e not fussed either way.
As long as it's no big bright flashy banners.
The advertising caption as an example ' Gav's custom whatevers' is fine.
It don't smack me in the face, and demand that I read it.
Gives me an idea who can make what for me.

As Andrew and Crispin said earlier, if it's too loud, then remove it, adn ask the owner to tone it down a bit.
i think thats fair enough.

Graham

 

[Andrew Prince]

Asking questions is totally fine! And this has been a good debate. The rules were wrong in this case and we're happy to change them to reflect what we as a club want - certainly not what the admin team as a tiny minority want!

Re the "Gav's Custom Fabs" in my sig - I suspect Gav would have a heart attack if he thought we were expecting him to go commercial That is if his recent mountaineering exertions haven't done him in already

Common sense has to have a role here - if people want to mention that they have Goodrich tyres, OME suspension, Slee sldiers etc, that is hardly commercial and is indirect advertising at best. Certainly the members putting that info in their sig do not stand to benefit financially at all. So 100% ok in my view!

Cheers,

 

[Rob]

right so no advertising in sig lines, but where do we draw the line? consider the following cases:

a link to your personal site (which may actually costs the owner money every time someone visits),
link to your facebook profile (is that advertising? well it certainly isnt from the users perspective but it probably is from facebook's perspective),
a link to say your local offroad club or 4x4 response network (this is clearly advertising but usually not for commercial gain)
a link to a charity you support (advertising but again not definitely not for personal gain)

I personally think that all the above do not fall in the term 'advertising' as i see no real commercial gain in any of the above. what do you think?

 

[Andrew Prince]

Would agree with you, Rob, but let's see what the wider view is. I think common sense and reasonableness should prevail

 

[Chris]

No prob, with Rob.

Chris

 

[Paul_Humphreys]

right so no advertising in sig lines, but where do we draw the line? consider the following cases:

a link to your personal site (which may actually costs the owner money every time someone visits),
link to your facebook profile (is that advertising? well it certainly isnt from the users perspective but it probably is from facebook's perspective),
a link to say your local offroad club or 4x4 response network (this is clearly advertising but usually not for commercial gain)
a link to a charity you support (advertising but again not definitely not for personal gain)

I personally think that all the above do not fall in the term 'advertising' as i see no real commercial gain in any of the above. what do you think?

I think it has to be on a sig by sig terms. I have advertising in my sig, for CRAG and 4X4 Response Wales. So where does this stand? If someone has their own business then I think a one line www link would be ok (with a 10% or more discount for members!!), but a full width clickable link would be too much.

As for the talk of Simon in here, why not? Everyone is welcome, even if some of their views might not be

 

[Chris]

I think that the key here is that anything in a sig, needs to be that - personal. Personal to yourself and relative to the forum. So CRAG would be fine. But Boots the Chemist, or Money Supermarket.com simply would not be. The sig should be about you and what you do / are interested in / support.

I think we all get this and can spot it when it's not right. The tricky bit is in making an absolute rule in advance. Bit like the difference between art and porn, I suppose. Difficult to describe the difference but you'd know it if you saw it. Err, I'd imagine

Chris

 

[Chas]

Chas

Bit like the difference between art and porn, I suppose. Difficult to describe the difference but you'd know it if you saw it. Err, I'd imagine
Chris

I wouldn't know as I never look at porn