Would you surrender?

[chadr]

NATO is primarily (read only) a defence organisation, so as Rob says above, no one is attacking a NATO country (and Putin knows better than to do that). Hence why the public opinion in countries like Finland and Sweden have swung in favour of joining NATO in recent day. Previously they majority was firmly against it.

 

[Juddian]

What's public opinion? statements in mainstream media owned by the likes of Black Rock and Vanguard being repeated by those who read or watch, or opinion polls which have a habit of producing the results favoured by those who paid for the poll.

 

[chadr]

Just like "referendums" you might say?

 

[Shayne]

For evil to prevail all it takes is for good men to do nothing .

"I was only following orders" kids 2 generations down the line will read in history lessons once again .

Russia has exposed its military might to be a myth and Ukraine is a free country inviting the whole world to enter with open arms .

Even if Putin has gone insane the kind of men attracted to that power are anything but suicidal which is exactly what the nuclear threat is .

 

[Shayne]

Pay for your gas in Roubles = check

Drop this demand or Ukraine will enter into NATO = checkmate .

 

[chapel gate]

Just like "referendums" you might say?

six years on and its still smarting.

thats one hell of a spanking son...

 

[chadr]

Yep, you can certainly say that we're all smarting now and it's only going to get worse. And that's for both sides, not just one.

But nevermind, you "won", I'll give you that.

Let get back to Ukraine or Russia or whatever it was that this thread was about....

 

[Shayne]

The winners of that debate are still being wheeled around in prams as yet , covid threw a huge spanner in the works nobody expected , and the mad rush toward electrification now has logical explanation , they accurately predicted long in advance whats happening in the Ukraine and the global effect .

 

[chapel gate]

Yep, you can certainly say that we're all smarting now and it's only going to get worse. And that's for both sides, not just one.

But nevermind, you "won", I'll give you that.

Let get back to Ukraine or Russia or whatever it was that this thread was about....

oh well, pails into insignificance compared to what the ukrainians are going through. fighting for their country, their flag, their history, their culture, their way of life...

i didnt win, my country won.

you did create the diversion, but yes, lets get back to Ukraine. it wasnt that long ago that "brexit" Britain was having to fly around germany to supply the Ukraine with defensive weapons because the germans didnt want to upset the communists that supplied nearly half of its gas? correct me if i am wrong, but the germans are still funding the russian war machine with nord stream 1?

europe, swanning around like a bunch of elitist socialists for as long as i care to remember whilst every other country fights there battles for them..

 

[karl2000]

But nevermind, you "won", I'll give you that.

Media statement: Vote Leave

www.electoralcommission.org.uk

 

[Shayne]

Fresh fines for Remain campaigners after referendum expenses breaches

Unions and Remain campaigners have been fined by election watchdogs over expenses breaches during the EU referendum.

www.politicshome.com

That party is over and evidently we would all still vote the same way again . We can't predict the future and we can't undo the past , our personal opinions or ideas carry no weight but its fun to share and discuss them . Silence was never of any benefit to opposing views .

 

[guyc]

When your T-14 Armata doesn't cut it, you need to resort to the old favourite.

 

[hopeless wanderer]

Looks almost like the Nazi arrows at the start of "Dad's Army" from Russia's perspective, No wonder the Russian leadership are a little concerned.
Poking the bear was never a smart move. East Ukraine and West Ukraine are probably how it will end. Obviously a proxy war is fine between ideologies when it's Afghans or Vietnamese people getting minced. Europeans.. Not so palatable.

 

[hopeless wanderer]

Indeed but lets face it the ruling classes will take money from whoever gives it. Boris playing tennis with one of Vlad's mates wife for a donation to the Tory party shows how deep the rot has set in. Even the local MP of my hometown has Russian donations. A dying steel town in the North East but still enough to attract a donation from who we now declare an enemy.
As for countries fighting for their flags, history, culture and beliefs. Eire anyone ? Sh8t let's go the whole hog ... The Taliban.

 

[hopeless wanderer]

I am not kidding you. I work with a Russian fella and these are things he genuinely believes.
Ukranians are Nazis.
Ukraine released Covid.
The massacres are all made up with either CGI or Hollywood makeup teams.
They have WMD's and need to be stopped.
The tanks you see being towed by tractors are replicas.
They were going to attack Moscow if they hadn't preempted them.

 

[Shayne]

Doesn't surprise me thats the power of propaganda , and if you own the media .................................

 

[hopeless wanderer]

This ship is crewed by a mixture of Russians, Ukranians, Filipinos and Indians. It's a powder keg right now and i cannot wait to get out of here.
Last time it was like this i was on a ship that was 50/50 Indian/Pakistani and they shot some jets down in a skirmish.(as they do periodically)
I was in the meeting explaining that workplace violence will not be tolerated, we are all shipmates etc etc. At the end of my speech i mentioned matter of factly that i had a solution which would result in long lasting peace between both nations. A few ears pricked up and said "What"
I replied "A united India under British rule" I was in stitches and the room was silent.

 

[Shayne]

And many see that as the good old days no doubt , and then someone else who wasn't there will throw a tantrum because ...... erm .... well just because

 

[chapel gate]

East Ukraine and West Ukraine are probably how it will end

i dont think this will be a good long term outcome, there will be decades of sporadic fighting and NI style bombings.

 

[Lucky]

I could not think of a more ignorant way of thinking by choosing option 2 FRANK RABBETS proposed.
When you make the analogy more personal tell me you will still choose option 2
ANALOGY
Big muscular brute breaks into your house and starts beating your wife and mother and is going to rape them.
Option 1
If you resist and put up a fight he is going to tie you up and destroy your house more and still rape your wife and mother.
Option 2
If you sit still and just watch him rape your wife and mother he will move permanently into your house and rape your wife and mother every day.

I know which option I would choose.

And on top of that if I screamed and yelled and my neighbours became aware of my situation and all they did was talk and offered me a cutlery knife to fight the Brute I would not think much of my neighbours even if the brute threatened my neighbours by threatening them with the rest of his gang members.

Ignorant people need to be educated that no matter the consequences no matter what the cost and price is the world and all other countries all other nations should intervene and stop the war even if it temporarily means a bigger and more dangerous war.

Keep in mind this world we live in with over 8 Billion people is never in the future going to be a peaceful world.
There will always be situations in the future
“I WANT WHAT YOU HAVE”
and eventually we will have a nuclear war be it today / tomorrow / next week / next month / next year / or 10, 20, 30, 40, 50, years from today.

Do you really believe in your right mind that only HITLER AND PUTIN were and are LUNATICS.

There are many more LUNATICS in this world and it is not if we are going to have a nuclear war but when are we going to have a nuclear war.

My choice is ket us stop the talking and threatening let us get it over and done with.
As far back we go back into history we know we cannot live peacefully with each other on this ball we call earth.

I for one would like to see the big muscle countries flex their muscles drop their atomic bombs destroy 70 % of the world population and from then onwards we will have one ruler who will be our real God that we can see listen to and obey not the pretend God we have today the one we cannot see and hear but for some religious organisations that want what you have “Your money” keep fooling us that this pretend God does really exist.

I just hope for the people that survive the nuclear war and gave to obey the new leader that they get a genuinely caring Ruler.

Keep in mind I do not care 2 hoots I am 73 years old and my days are number on this earth anyhow so as far as I am concerned if you rob me of my few final years it would not bother me.

Now put yourself in TYRAN PUTINS position if he loses this war the world will chase him to kill him so what does he have to loose by starting a nuclear war
If he wins the war the world will still chase him and yes he could live a protected life in Russia but eventually nature will win and he also will have to die so what will he have to lose than by pressing the button on his death bed.

PUTIN IS A LUNATIC AND NEEDS TO BE STOPPED NOW