Bushes

[Mblinko]

Has anyone used Whiteline bushes from Roughtrax ? If so, what are they like to install and use?

 

[MarkW]

Replaced the bushes on my 95 Lower rear link arms with whiteline bushes last summer. Very easy to install and seem ok at the moment but only have 5000 miles on them

 

[Mblinko]

Thanks Mark. Think I'll give them a go.

 

[grantw]

Thanks Mark. Think I'll give them a go.

Please update here with how you find them

 

[frank rabbets]

Are these the type of bush without an outer steel tube ? If so they may not be suitable for large suspension travel as they will wear the eyes of the suspension arms etc on your LC.

 

[MarkW]

How would a piece of urethene wear suspension faster than hard steel?

The bush itself should not be rotating within the eyes anyway unless they are a very bad fit. The rotattion should be through the inner sleeve and bolt arrangement.

 

[frank rabbets]

Why do they bother fitting an outer steel sleeve if there is no advantage? If the urethane is hard then it will turn in the eyes which are not designed for friction. I don't know exactly how these bushes work but I do know that some are designed to rotate in the eyes of the arms. They even supply the grease. However these bushes I describe are for cars with very little suspension movement and probably low annual mileage. It's just a word of warning. Why not use the correct bushes ?

 

[Rob Cowell]

Do Toyota sell bushes for the 80? I ask because they don't for the 120. You have to buy the complete arm. I put in cheapy Milners orange bushes when my originals started to go between 80-100K miles. One of my top arms snapped within 3K miles of doing the bushes in that, which could be related. No problem with the others though. 150K miles now and something is knocking very slightly on rough tracks. I don't do any really axle twisting stuff but on unmade tracks / roads every day. My plan was to get new arms complete with bushes from Amayama when I get round to doing the job again.

 

[Mblinko]

Yes, these do have a steel sleeve.

As for why, we know that the bushes must not rotate in the arms. So, if they came without sleeves, they would rotate, no question. When they have sleeves the rubber is bonded to the steel so it does not rotate and when pressed in, they won't rotate.

As for why not originals, first the big ones are in the order of £50 each (not a set) plus VAT and delivery and second I haven't found a reason why not ..... reputation seems good, quality seems good, warranty is good .....

I hope the experience is good too.

 

[Mblinko]

Do Toyota sell bushes for the 80? ...

yes, they do.

 

[MarkW]

The Whiteline bushes I used do not require a press to fit, where as the Toyota ones (if available) would need a press. The grease supplied is not for use between the bush and the eye and the instructions are explicit on stating this. The grease is for the steel sleeve inside the bush that the bolt goes through and the mounting face to avoid squeaking. The bushes are designed to have the pivot point/rotation around the inner steel sleeve not the outside edge of the urethane.

Whiteline bushes certainly have a very good reputation and being Australian in origin I'm sure they are up to the demands of off road use

Obviously mine are on a 95 not an 80 but I'd be very surprised if theres any difference in the way they function

PS still can't see that urethane/elastomer would wear a steel part, the bush would wear if anything.

 

[Mblinko]

Whiteline offer fitter friendly bushes for the 80, i.e. no sleeve. Roughtrax don't have the full line up. I've ordered what they have which is sleeved rear trailing arm bushes. the rest are fitter friendly - but there is a confusing line on the spec which says they come with sleeves , so need to wait and see.

I'd be interested to hear what others think about rotating - I've always been told they should not. If the sleeve rotates, I would think that's a problem for wear on the arm. But if no sleeve, it will - is that a problem ?

 

[frank rabbets]

The Toyota ones have inner and outer sleeves. If you cut one in half axially you find that the rubber is bonded to the steel. There can be no movement in the eye of the arm as they are a very heavy fit. Rust can creep between the rubber and the sleeves destroying the bond. Polyurethane bushes could attract water and rust the arm itself even if they do not move. If they do move they are working in a contaminated environment so wear would be inevitable. Soft material can wear hard material as in green wheels for sharpening tungsten carbide. I don't like the idea of the pin sleeve forming part of a moving joint. On the polyurethane bushes I've used on other cars the arm defo moves against the polyurethane if you move the arm much. I don't know the Land Cruiser poly bushes but just a word of caution that's all.

 

[MarkW]

What about rose joints? they work in exactly the same way as rubber/elastomer bushes, the pivot is the inner sleeve not the outer

 

[frank rabbets]

I've used those Rose Joints. They wear out really quickly if they are not protected and oiled. OK for track use and classic aircraft construction.

 

[Mblinko]

The sleeved bushes have an arc of operation, hence the FSM instructs that they be torqued when on all four wheels, else the rubber will tear away from the bond it has with the sleeves, in essence they are a bearing and because they are rubber are more forgiving than rose joints which, as Frank says, are good for track use.

If articulation gets well over standard, then maybe the poly bushes are better, because they are even more forgiving than sleeved ones given neither inner or outer sleeve is bonded. In theory, this will detrimentally affect handling, though I have read that if they are badly made, I.e. too big and the sleeve is narrower than the bush, then when they are torqued up, they lock the joint up......I've no experience of that, though it makes sense.

 

[frank rabbets]

Yes when one has fitted the arm with the new bushes the car will most likely be up in the air so it's important to drop it down on it's wheels and then do the bush pins up otherwise the rubber will be stressed even with the car level.

 

[warrenpfo]

Morning, Any update or further thoughts on the bushes as i need to do my 80 and given the cost of Toyota bushes it does not make sense. There does not seem ot be a whiteline dealer in SA but am sure i can make a plan.

 

[Mblinko]

Yes, they arrived the other day.......



The upper and lower drag link bushes have been pressed in without problem and I refitted them with the new anti roll bar bushes without any problems.



The only thing I had to do was trim off about 1mm of rubber from the ARB drop link bush, to make them the same as width as the steel sleeve because they wouldn't fit the drop link fork. On a related note, if you are replacing the drop links as I did with Roughtrax ones, be prepared to grind a slot in the end of them for a screwdriver because they don't have a hex Allen key slot in the end like Toyota ones do. If you don't you can't do them up as they just turn.

I haven't fitted the front ones yet or driven it as I've got other jobs to do.

 

[Mblinko]

I fitted the front leading arm bushes yesterday ...
.
No dramas, all very easy, the rear ones needed a tiny bit of persuasion using the vice, nothing major.

I took it for a drive today. Compared with how it was, the car feels much better, more taught albeit a little bit stiffer, but I can live with that.

Thumbs up from me. Now to see how they are in rugged use.