Drive belts + alternator retaining bolt question

[Jeremy L-Jones]

Strange noises from the front yesterday so after a quick look saw that all 3 drive belts were slack and needed replacing. As I had a set of new belts I decided to get on and do it today. Wish I'd done it in the summer...All went well if a little slowly as it was cold working on the streets where in live in North London. Unfortunately, perhaps due to lack of coffee, I loosened the alternator retaining bolt at the bottom under the pulley too much and it came out. Once the new belts were in place it was a right bugger to get the bolt back in and as darkness set in, despite an array of headtorches and a battery fluorescent I couldn't finish off so the bottom retaining bolt is in place, doesn't seem to want to tighten and is difficult to extract. I've done most of the sensible things including running a narrow object through the opening to make sure everything is lined up but for something so simple it's proving difficult. As I was trying one last time I managed to thump the joint at the base of my thumb making things very painful.

If anyone else has had similar experience and can suggest a clever trick I'd be very grateful for some advice.

Thanks and hope everyone is well.

Jeremy

 

[Bat21]

Jeremy, if you have already tightened the alternator belts then you will need to slacked them off again by winding the adjuster bolt off, be sure to also undo the bolt that allows the alternator to slide on its adjuster bracket.

Once the belts are slack you should be able to 'jiggle' the alternator around enough to get the bottom bolt back in.

The alternator can be very tight in its mounting bracket so be patient.

 

[karl webster]

Hi jeremy
Take your baelts back off. Make sure the bottom bolt is in nearly all the way. Put alternator over towards the engine as close as it will go and tighten bottom bolt up. Put your belts back on and use a bar to move alternator back away from the engine. Tighten with the 12mm bolt to where you want it. Then lock the other top bolt off. Works for me.
Karl

 

[Jeremy L-Jones]

Jeremy, if you have already tightened the alternator belts then you will need to slacked them off again by winding the adjuster bolt off, be sure to also undo the bolt that allows the alternator to slide on its adjuster bracket.

Once the belts are slack you should be able to 'jiggle' the alternator around enough to get the bottom bolt back in.

The alternator can be very tight in its mounting bracket so be patient.

Thanks Paul - I've slackened the adjuster bolt and it's lock nut, wasn't sure what you meant by the bolt that allows the alternator to slide on it's bracket...

Cheers

Jeremy

 

[Jeremy L-Jones]

Hi jeremy
Take your baelts back off. Make sure the bottom bolt is in nearly all the way. Put alternator over towards the engine as close as it will go and tighten bottom bolt up. Put your belts back on and use a bar to move alternator back away from the engine. Tighten with the 12mm bolt to where you want it. Then lock the other top bolt off. Works for me.
Karl

Karl, thanks for this. What I don't get is that the bottom retaining bolt is in and has maybe 1.5cms to go... but it's not biting on the thread...

Jeremy

 

[Bat21]

Karl, thanks for this. What I don't get is that the bottom retaining bolt is in and has maybe 1.5cms to go... but it's not biting on the thread...

Jeremy

If that's the case it sounds like the thread on the bolt or the bracket is buggered.

The best way to see what is happening is to remove the problematic bolt and the adjuster bracket on the top, unplug the wiring plug from the rear and remove the nut* to release the single wire on the top.

You can now remove the alternator and see if the bolt winds into the bracket freely.

* be sure the spanner does not touch anything metal while undoing the nut*

 

[karl webster]

Its probably because you already have tightend The belts up maybe. I have done it before myself. As paul stated though the alternator sits in the bottom bracket very very tightly.
I had to grind a touch of the bracket once as there was no chance it was going to go in. Once everything is free try bolting the bottom bracket up on its own. Was it really tight to undo? I carnt imagine you have cross threaded it putting it in as the thread is about three inches away. Maybe the alternator isnt square in the bracket and infact the bolt is starting to try anc cross thread.
karl

 

[Chris]

Just to be clear, Jeremy, there are three bolts on the alternator. Karl and Paul are spot on with their advice, but aware that you might be getting confused by all the bolts.

One is the hinge that allows the alternator to pivot. This is about 6" long and runs from front to back (underneath out of sight). It should be tightened up when your are finished.
One is the adjuster. This runs left to right and is the bolt that us used to wind the alternator back and forth on the pivot bolt.
Lastly, there is the lock off bolt. This too runs front to back and is only a couple of inches long, somewhere over the top of the alternator.

What I have found happens is that people try to adjust the second bolt without slacking off the third one first. This results in stripping the thread. Or at least like on mine, bending the bolt. It's a common thread so can be replaced with something out of the garage if needs be. If the locking bolt has been stuffed up, you can use a longer bolt and simply put a nut on the back of it.
So you should slacken the pivot bolt a little, slacken the lock bolt tighten the adjuster slide bolt then tighten the other two back up again. You might get away without slacking the pivot bolt, but it makes it hard and of course can result in stripping or bending the adjuster bolt.

Apols if you weren't confused in the first place. In any case, it's not a difficult fix.

Chris

 

[Jeremy L-Jones]

Just to be clear, Jeremy, there are three bolts on the alternator. Karl and Paul are spot on with their advice, but aware that you might be getting confused by all the bolts.
Chris

Cheers Chris. You're right, its not a difficult fix but just a pain in the butt that a routine job becomes difficult. I'll just have to go back out at some point when I can take a break from work... a little harder than it should be right now. Locknut and adjuster all duly loosened, the lower retaining bolt was loosened and in a moment of madness came out completely... it's back in place but not biting. Last time it came out ~I checked and there was no thread damage... what is a real pain, literally, is I've done something to my lower thumb joint near the wrist which makes spanner work almost impossible.

Anyway, no great shakes but thanks to everyone for all the help. It's got to better than christmas shopping....

Jeremy

 

[Chris]

Ahh, I'm with you. Yes, it needs to be lined up quite precisely or it doesn't go in. Bit of a swine. You need to knock the alternator up and down a bit. Usually up. You can get straight to it from underneath with a bit of broom handle and a hammer. Been there recently. Tiny bit off and it won't go into the thread.

Chris

 

[Paul]

Is it possible the bottom bolt had a nut on it like you said that has now dropped off?

 

[Chris]

It's a lug on the side of the engine block and it's threaded inside, Paul.

Chris

 

[Jeremy L-Jones]

Ahh, I'm with you. Yes, it needs to be lined up quite precisely or it doesn't go in. Bit of a swine. You need to knock the alternator up and down a bit. Usually up. You can get straight to it from underneath with a bit of broom handle and a hammer. Been there recently. Tiny bit off and it won't go into the thread.Chris

Access is a bit of a pain for me as I've got a bash plate in the way and I'm on the street... it's my bloody thumb that stops me getting on to it today...

Jeremy

 

[Chris]

Lot easier without the air con pump in the way too. I took mine off when I was removing the alternator.

Chris

 

[Jeremy L-Jones]

Lot easier without the air con pump in the way too. I took mine off when I was removing the alternator.Chris

This is true... may be the next step...

 

[Chris]

You do get a lot more space to work and you can see what you are doing. The long bolt on mine was completely stuffed. Someone had been adjusting it without slackening the locking nut.

Chris

 

[Jeremy L-Jones]

You do get a lot more space to work and you can see what you are doing. The long bolt on mine was completely stuffed. Someone had been adjusting it without slackening the locking nut.Chris

You do indeed - at one point I did try and undo the two bolts holding the a/c pump but they were so tight I left them. I'm at work now but wouldn't even attempt anything today in this rather grim freezing fog stuff...

the weird thing is that the retaining bolt at the bottom is so close...

Jeremy

 

[Bat21]

You do indeed - at one point I did try and undo the two bolts holding the a/c pump but they were so tight I left them. I'm at work now but wouldn't even attempt anything today in this rather grim freezing fog stuff...

the weird thing is that the retaining bolt at the bottom is so close...

Jeremy

There are 4 bolts holding the AC pump onto its mounting bracket.

My guess is you have pulled the alternator slightly out of line when tightening the belts, and that will be why the bottom bolt won't start onto the thread.

Let us know how you get on

 

[Jeremy L-Jones]

Let us know how you get on

Will do... I may have to recruit help as the base of my right thumb is very painful - it was swollen like a ham but now reduced...making it impossible to grip anything like a wrench/spanner...

Jeremy

 

[ajnabi]

Just following this, as I've got a pretty prominent squeal when cold starting these days.
Does anyone know what the torque settings are for the Pivot (Swivel) Bolt, and the Lock Bolt?
Can't find anything in the FSM's/Haynes or Max Ellery's book.

IQ