Non Starting

[Jon Wildsmith]

To test if the 12/24v change over solenoid is working you can measure the voltage between the passenger side battery +ve terminal and the engine block. Before you turn the key it should be approximately 12v. When you turn the key to start and hold it in that position the voltage should rise to 24v plus. Remember to put the meter on a range that goes up to 30v if it isn't auto range. If it shows >= 24v the 12/24v solenoid is working.

The starter solenoid relay which is the relay Dave mentioned in the passenger side wing set into the hole you access the radio aerial through is a fairly chunky relay so you should be able to feel it clicking if it is working but you might not be able to hear it over the clonk of the change over solenoid. They do have drain holes in the bottom but they have been known to be mounted upside down so the drain holes become water inlets! You can take the can off the relay quite easily if you want a peek inside but I would check there is +12v and 0v across the terminals when you turn the key first. The +12v comes from the ignition switch, the 0v is switched by a relay module in the passenger side kick panel that will only connect it to 0v when it senses 24v at the 12/24v change over solenoid.

 

[Dave2000]

The starter solenoid relay which is the relay Dave mentioned in the passenger side wing set into the hole you access the radio aerial through is a fairly chunky relay so you should be able to feel it clicking if it is working but you might not be able to hear it over the clonk of the change over solenoid. They do have drain holes in the bottom but they have been known to be mounted upside down so the drain holes become water inlets!

That the one Jon! I could not remember it's exact location but IIRC it had been mounted upside down as you mentioned and was corroded to buggery inside. The fact that at this moment it is p*ssing down with rain in the UK is what made me think about it.

Regards

Dave

 

[1self]

I had the same problem a few months ago when I purchased mine. Made the mistake of listening to an AA man and mechanic I did not know and ended up with a hefty bill for a new starter motor! What an idiot!
Anyway, had the same click. Could see nothing wrong, batteries are both in top condition. Ended up happening a few more times at random places, went through all the wiring after asking the guys on here and reading through a few searches. Cleaned up all the connections on the 12/24V crossover, battery, ground etc..... fingers crossed, have not had a problem since!!
Starts on the button now. So as the others have suggested, check and clean all contact points before shelling out for unnecessary new parts.
Good luck.

 

[frank rabbets]

Typical Toyota dealer advice. Glowplug on an engine which does not have glowplugs .

 

[Compact3]

Thanks for the advice Jon. In between snow showers I have 24v appearing on the meter, which way to go next of the many?
John

 

[Chris]

Earth to engine block.

As we know the car uses the body and chasis as an earth return. But the engine is mounted in rubber blocks as is the exhaust so it has no return path. The starter is bolted to the engine so IT has no return path either. This is why there is an earth strap from the block. It's bolted onto the 24v change over and the bottom of the engine in a place where it gets wet and filthy. It also flexes with the engine. If that is compromised the the starter won't fire. Like I said the simple test is to put a jump lead from the battery neg to the engine hoist loop to by pass the factory earth strap. I had exactly your symptoms and did this test and it fired better than it had ever done. I have mentioned it a couple of times but can't see that you have done this yet, I may have missed it.

 

[Compact3]

Thanks Chris. Bit late in doing that one. Tried this morning -nothing unfortunately.

Jiohn

 

[Shayne]

If all else fails and i'm thinking it's time to hand it over to the guys who will gladly change parts at random until they accidentally fix the problem all at your expense i would bump start it as a last ditch effort . It's unlikely but sometimes water can get into unusual places especially when it freezes and a short drive might dry it out . Nothing ventured nothing gained .

 

[Chris]

Dang. OK going to have to think. The next thing really is the solenoids contacts in the starter motor. It's really the only other component that regulalry fails. There is a big circle of copper and it sits down onto a contact plate at 9 o'clock and 3 o'clock. What happens is that eventually the copper disc eats through the contacts. Now for a while it will still touch at the very edges but it reaches a point where it just won't anymore and click click. The remedy is to replace the innards with a kit. It's simple stuff but you need a degree of spanner-ability. First time is the hardest, but I can get mine off now in under 10 minutes. Autos are harder as the cable bundle that sits on the top of the motor is thicker and really hard to work around.

 

[Compact3]

The fault in the system appears to be that there is no power in the energiser wire aka the exciter wire. That could mean broken wire or a dodgy key barrel I suppose.
John.

 

[Jon Wildsmith]

The fault in the system appears to be that there is no power in the energiser wire aka the exciter wire. That could mean broken wire or a dodgy key barrel I suppose.
John.

Good news that the 12/24v change over solenoid is working Do you mean the thin wire that goes to the starter solenoid when you say energiser wire? The relay that energises the starter solenoid could be faulty, this is the one Dave mentioned as being prone to filling up with water and corroding. That's what caused my last starter failure. It is a medium sized silver metal can with a pale plastic peaked bottom (or top if upside down) and is mounted near the passenger side bonnet hinge, on the inner wing, where there is a large hole. I would take a picture to point it out for you but I seem to have misplaced my 80 You should be able to feel that clicking when you turn the key to start, you probably won't hear it over the other clicks/clonks but you should feel it. If it isn't clicking there's a pretty good chance that's the faulty part - you can take the can off quite easily and have a look at the insides. You can also disconnect it and probe the connector terminals but I can't remember what the connector looks like to tell you which wire should be +12 and which 0v etc so a visual inspection of the internals may be the simplest next check.

 

[Gary Stockton]

Oh alright I'll take a picture in the morning.

Good description from memory JW

 

[Compact3]

Yes, that is the wire I was referring to. The weather was so foul I resorted to the RAC in the end. He looks after two other 80,s so I assume he is right, he started the engine it by supplying the power required from underneath the vehicle which means the starter is OK as well. I look forward to the pic of the relay.

 

[Gary Stockton]

Think this is what Jon is referring to. Its in the right place

Sorry crappy pics

 

[Gary Stockton]

Hmm. Tapatalk has rotated them 90 degrees. The diesel lines run above it

 

[Compact3]

Sighted relay felt it click when key was turned. So it looks as if the problem is between that relay and the starter motor.

 

[Bat21]

Is your 80 an auto or manual?

 

[Compact3]

It is a 1995 manual GS model

 

[Towpack]

Make sure the relay has power to the feed contact and that it's switching it through to the load contact. If the contacts are bad, Just because the relay is operating doesn't necessarily mean it's transferring power. If it is a break in the wire from the relay to the starter solenoid it shouldn't be much of a job to run a new one if that is required.

 

[Jon Wildsmith]

Sighted relay felt it click when key was turned. So it looks as if the problem is between that relay and the starter motor.

The fact it is clicking rules out a few more things that could be wrong but as Towpack said it could be bad contacts so I'd open it up and have a look inside.