Non Starting

[Compact3]

Jumped in the vehicle today turn the key, nothing but a little click. Looking from the front the left hand battery reads 12.36 and the right one 12.24. My garage man via the phone says it should start. I have put some jump leads on from another vehicle still nothing. It worked perfectly well 2 days ago. I have tapped the starter motor with a hammer, still nothing. Any thoughts would be welcome. One battery is 7 years old the other is newer. But the readings seem to be OK.

John

 

[Towpack]

Any idea where the click is coming from? Check with a meter at the lead on the main starter terminal and you should have 12v with the car stood idle. This should change to 24v when the the key is turned to the engine crank position. If not, the 12 to 24v switchover system isn't operating. Usually, when the batteries are too low to crank the engine you get a rat-tat-tat machine gun sound, not just one click.

 

[Chris]

You really need a proper load test on the batteries. It can sit at 12 volts but not have any oomph. Do as TP suggests but also try this with your headlights on as a drain. I would also take a jump lead and connect it from either battery negative to the lifting eye on the engine. Poor earth from the changeover relay to the engine block is not uncommon.

 

[Compact3]

Thanks Towpack/Chris. Just ordered/asked my wife to listen while standing out in a force 9 to the noise when turning the key and it is one click, I was expecting the rat tat tat noise as well. The click definitely comes from the starter motor.

John

 

[Chris]

Try that earth lead trick. It's all about elimination.

 

[Towpack]

If the batteries are shagged I'd expect at least some movement with a jump from a good batt so I don't think they're the problem personally. The large contacts in the starter solenoid have been known to give problems on these, from open circuit to jamming/welding on, leaving the starter spinning with the engine running. If the earth lead jumper trick doesn't work and you're getting full voltage at the main starter terminal, I'd check these contacts. requires removal of the starter/solenoid assembly but not a difficult task and access is good.

 

[Chris]

I have to agree. Three most common are batteries (or usually one battery) earth to engine or the pesky copper contacts in the solenoid. The changeover solenoids are pretty bombproof designed for a lifetime/ With taking the top off the change over relay and just wiggle / tighten the connections on there. But do be careful some are live to don't earth them. I found a loose one on my grey truck and being loose caused some burning which in turn made the connection worse

 

[Shayne]

Being light years behind most on the forum in mechanical matters i always look for the easiest fix which is often overlooked and that would be to clean the battery terminals .

 

[Dave2000]

There is a relay on the passenger side inner wing, near the bonnet hinge, often clicks and does nothing as the terminals are corroded, water runs off the gutter straight on to it.

Also, it is impossible to monitor/check individual battery voltage with batteries that are in parallel as they are in the 80. Disconnect the batteries and load test them individually, it is not uncommon for one battery to go bad and pull the other down with it when they are connected together. It is problems like this that swayed me so I converted mine to a 12 volt system a few years back....still works great.

regards

Dave

 

[frank rabbets]

I diagnosed my dud battery by turning the ign key with a voltmeter on each battery in turn. One battery read 12volt but went to zero when I turned the key. This is in fact a heavy load test. Once I knew which battery I jumped it with a 12volt battery. NOT a car.

 

[Dave2000]

If the batteries were in parallel Frank any idea how the 'good' battery did not 'mask' the bad battery and show the same voltage (as near as makes no odds) across each of them?

regards

Dave

 

[frank rabbets]

When you turn the key they are in series so you can measure each battery separately. That's if there is enough power to click the crossover switch.

 

[frank rabbets]

Sorry Dave, my fault. Yes off key they were 12 volt but when the key was turned one went down to zero. Off load "they" read 12 volt so I don't know.

 

[Compact3]

Thanks for all the replies regarding non starting. Having been able to get outside between snow /rain / hail and listen without the wind, the clicking sound is coming from a a small cylinder with the neg lead from the right hand battery going into it and a couple of leads coming out of it one of which goes to the other battery. It is situated just behind the right hand battery looking from the front of the vehicle. I assume that it is renewable.
John

 

[Chas]

Yep, that's the 12/24v relay, they are easily replaced. I had this problem recently, I can't help with a price as I got mine from a friend on the forum who just happened to have a spare left over from his 80.
As a temporary 'fix' try tapping the relay firmly while someone turns the key, it was doing this that identified my problem.

 

[Chris]

It's pretty rare these go and they are several hundred pounds. I really would suggest that there is another issue here before that. Work through all the simple and obvious stuff first - usually the cheapest too. If it's clicking then it sounds like it's working. It's when they don't click that you have to worry.

Batteries, connections, earths, solenoid contacts and then maybe the change over relay.

 

[Compact3]

Thanks for that Chas. I emailed a picture of it to my local Toyota dealership and having passed it around they tell me it is the Glow Plug Relay part no 2861017080. Just looked at a glow plug relay on a website and it looks nothing like the item I sent a picture of. I would have thought it would have been called a Voltage Converter or something like that. The price of their item is £262. Something wrong somewhere.
John

 

[clivehorridge]

My experience says do as Chris suggested, check all the connections first.

Not only is it free, it will 9/10 times cure the problem. In any event, only then will you be able to start to diagnose a potential failing component, knowing that it's getting a reliable power supply.

 

[Chris]

Nah, nothing to do with glow plugs. It's a black box with a plastic cover held on with a small screw. It's between the washer bottle and the injection pump. Part is 28420-17011 Relay assembly voltage converter. It's €480 Got a wire from a small junction box that say B+ on it, one that goes to the starter and an earth plus another live somewhere

Chris

 

[Chris]