The Edit Button-Giving members more control.

[Olazz]

There has been some discussion on here in the past (2010 according to search), where the topic of allowing the members to have permanent edit facility was discussed. At the time I believe the decision was that it should be limited to 15 min because of the potential for malicious behaviour of perhaps a disgruntled member.

Is there any evidence to suggest that this actually happens in reality. There are numerous sites out there that have permanent edit facility without any problems.

LCCSA, which is a much busier and more proactive site than this with many more members, has a permanent edit facility and there has been no foul-play in the years its been running.

Let us assume for one moment, that someone actually does delete some, or indeed all of their posts on here for a reason, malice aforethought or otherwise...so what? Hardly going to bring the site down now is it?
"It would be unfair " has also been mooted... to whom may I ask? In what way unfair?

Should we really be expected to appeal to admin and seek permission to edit a post? After-all, we aren't at school anymore.

Perhaps the reality is somewhat more sinister in that some just want to excercise complete control of content and editorial?

Isn't it now time for a review of this policy within ELCOC?

Your comments fellow members.

 

[Chas]

Re: The Edit Button

It's not really been a problem for me, but I would like to see it lengthened, to say 30mins

 

[Chris]

Re: The Edit Button

All anyone has to do is ask a Moderator. There are times when someone says something contentious, then they go back and change what they said once the balloon goes up. As a Mod, it's sometimes difficult to make decisions about what to do when the original comment has disappeared. This can actually be within the 15 mins if there are a good number of people on at the time.

I'd rather leave it pretty much as it is and remind people to use preview to look at what they have written before posting. Whilst a typo is perhaps an annoying thing to some, lifting the edit time simply for that could create more issues than it solves. At times the forum is more like a chat room with the speed that people post at. Going back and editing inside a thread would make that tricky to follow. It's all fun on here, usually, but keeping track is hard enough as it is.

I would rebuff the suggestion that this is anyway to do with control freakery. Just remember exactly HOW and WHY this forum was created. I am on here probably as much if not more than most. I have had possibly one maybe 2 occasions where I have been asked to make a change. Most people just create a new post and add/ edit what they said.

We always said that in the future there would be those who come along who were not there at the beginning and not know about the origins of this forum. Having been there at the start it's easy to dismiss questions at times. But they are welcomed and must be answered. However, the answers may not always be to the liking of the questioner - and that's life.

My view - leave it as it is. No need to change it. Not through fear of what it might let in which I don't think would be much, but I don't see a particular benefit either.

Chris

 

[Ecoman]

Re: The Edit Button

Is there any evidence to suggest that this actually happens in reality. There are numerous sites out there that have permanent edit facility without any problems.

I can put hand on heart and say yes I have seen it happen. Not on here mind but rather on the Hilux Owners Club forum I'm a moderator on. It happened on 2 seperate occasions and thats what prompted us to introduce the 1 hour edit time deadline.

The first occasion is when we asked a member to stop trying to sell his gearbox x-members, bumpers and diff guards on the site as he was blatantly copying another, long standing members designs (that were copyright) and palming off inferior copies at a reduced price. He came back on and edited his posts advertising his latest products, prices and contact details outside the forum.

The second was when a chap had fallen out with a few members and decided to leave the club. In the process he deleted the contents of all his posts and then replaced his original text with random porn images and foul language.

 

[Graham]

Re: The Edit Button

I would really like to see a permanent edit button

I guess the posts are backed up on a regular basis.
It would not be too difficult to reinstate the posts, and remove the member.

You have the same thing really with the photobucket account,
If a member has posted images, it is all to easy for the member to relocate them within Photobucket.
This maintains the images in Photobucket, but breaks the links, an therby not showing the image.

I guess the members here are responsible, and the edit button is for us numb nuts who can't spell,
I herby vote to have a permanent edit button.

Gra.

 

[Crispin]

Re: The Edit Button

We had a discussion about this a while back. There is a case for perhaps extending it but as Chris has said, posts become out of context pretty quickly and lost on the previous page. If there is something that desperately needs editing then any one of the guys whose name is in green would do it.

Most forums I use and contribute to which include a lot of IT, RC, electrical and some other car related forums all have either a no edit (a bit harsh) or a 15-30 minute edit. Thereafter you need a mod to make any changes.

LCCSA are perhaps a bit relaxed about it because they know your grandmother’s maiden man from the signup process and it is a “closed” group and not open to the public like this one is. Only vetting that gets done on new users is making sure they’re not from Pakistan, Russia or India (spam havens it would appear)

There is little harm in extending the edit thing (say 30 minutes?) though if it is really a problem for some and they would like to correct or tweak something. I think that also gets stopped once someone replies to a post.

Cheers,
CP

 

[Paul]

Re: The Edit Button

I think its fine as it is.

 

[Rob]

Re: The Edit Button

I would like to see an increase in edit time to 30 min as proof reading does not always work for dyslexics however coming back and reading it later does.

 

[uHu]

Re: The Edit Button

I still haven't seen any valid reason for restricting the possibilities to edit. The two examples mentioned above could have been done even without editing old posts - just make new ones.

All the big LC-forums have "free" editing: mud, Lcool, & nlck.no, even after other postings on the thread, and I have not heard of any problems with that.

There are several occasions when I see after a bit, an hour or a day or two, that what looked very clear when I posted it, actually looks a bit ambiguous. And who wants to bother someone else to fix a small problem like that?

Edit:
Study the "traffic" (or sequences) of posts and edits on mud. It works very well. In some cases people actually post a new post to say that they have edited the long, technically heavy, post further up.
In other cases there is an initial first post that will "forever" (e.g. a few years) hold the only important info in the thread, and with new posts added as comments and suggestions which the original poster then incorporates in the main, first post. It is so much more dynamic to be able to edit forever - the forum will be better - WE can make the forum better.


PS: Edited three times

 

[Ecoman]

Re: The Edit Button

I still haven't seen any valid reason for restricting the possibilities to edit. The two examples mentioned above could have been done even without editing old posts - just make new ones.

It all depends on the forum software as you can revoke posting privileges but the may still be able to edit old posts.

 

[joinerman]

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

 

[LandCruiser1978]

Personally think an open editing policy wouldn't be a bad thing ..

Don't see why there should be a limit

 

[karl webster]

Doesnt bother me at all. Sometimes i read posts back and ive made spelling mistakes etc. Doesnt really matter.

Karl

 

[Mark N]

fine ass is becus i dont mayk speling mistaks...

 

[Chris]

Mark you may have a couple of mins left to edit that if you want.

Chris

 

[Gav Peter]

Leave well alone IMHO...

 

[MuckyPup]

Just a thought here, I suffer from Discalculia which is sort of dyslexia but with numbers and (more importantly) order.
It can take 3 or 4 re-writes before a post makes sense, then a preview and even then an edit or two.
A day or so later given the chance i would re-write something entirely, as far as forums go i don't unless someone has gotten hold of the wrong end of the stick since doing so would make a thread unreadable.
Other forums i've been on you couldn't edit the FIRST thread starting post but you could edit the others.
the 15 minute limit here doesn't worry me or cause me any real difficulty, if it makes Mods lives easier then so be it..

Edit; Blimiey, that was a lot of words to say booger all..........

 

[Sam]

Open editing would be great for when I realise I've been a muppet and want to retract what I've said. Or take out about 300 words and just get to the point because I "have" been known to ramble on about... oops doing it again!

Personally, I think the idea of editing your first post to update important info from other pages could be a real time saver and the strongest argument - but potentially at the price of the to and fro of the threads... It's a community thing that could very easily lose something that way.

More importantly I would say that for the sake of continuity it's important to maintain original content. It would be all too easy to edit something that left the thread disjointed and without a cohesive flow (wow big words!).

I suppose it depends on what the overall "feel" of the forums is supposed to be. A well managed resource for information sharing and community activity - or a sandpit for members to play in a free for all. Both ideas are great. But a well managed protected (or moderated) system brings the real extra benefits of cohesive content.

So, for me... I applaud the work being done in the short time I've been here, and more importantly I have always had the feeling the moderators are approachable and willing to respect both privacy and peoples rights to control their content. (A complex issue). I have no reason to believe I couldn't remove or change something that was upsetting me... all I've heard so far is apologising profusely for taking longer than 12 seconds to do anything!

I started out designing and building software like the one we are using here and have debated the issues at length many many times. At the end of the day, IMHO, it's always about the moderation. Get that wrong and people will vote with their feet. From what I understand this whole community was founded on just that principle.

The best you can hope for is a well managed system with people you can trust "moderating" the flow of content while leaving control in the hands of the community. Which importantly, is a very different thing from controlling it.

So in short ... well done chaps. Got it spot on in my view. And thank you.

PayPal account ready and waiting chaps......

 

[uHu]

Here is one example on the requirement for an edit button, from T0yoDIY.com:

Quote
For active internet forum users (by active we mean those who participate in the DIY community by giving something back) we are offering access to more information than is available to regular site members. This is our way of thanking those individuals who spend extra time by sharing their knowledge with others.

If you are one of those people, you can apply for innercircle access below.

How does this work? You show us that you did participate in forums by temporarily placing a code on one of your earlier made posts, we confirm it and grant you access. Then the code can be removed. In most cases you can get access immediately.
/quote

 

[Graham]

I can understand the Admin's position, where there could be an upset member, and for some reason, he/she decides to delete or adjust all their previous posts.
However, I guess the forum is auto backed up frequently?
If the Admin do see some serious posts deletions and adjustments, then the first thing would be to restrict that member totally, pending some questioning.
May be there is a valid point?
Then run the back up to reinstate the deleted or adjusted posts.
Then find out from the memeber what the problem is.
There may be a grievance?

Gra.