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24v vs 12v 80 series ...
- Thread starter Red Oktober
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nielsc
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The 24v is a more refined engine and has more potential, but is more complicated, the 24v has more power in the higher RPM range, the 12v has more power at lower revs and more simple (no emission stuff and ECU), injectors are easier to get at and cheaper, ...
both are very good.
both are very good.
Michael Montgomery
Well-Known Member
The 1HD-FT was the bases for the later 1HD-FTE with inlet manifold, fuel pump, bigger turbo, intercooler plus a ECu brain amougst other changes producing the same economy plus around 40bhp more with more torque. In my view having seen them here a far superior engine.
Thank you very much for the quick response.
What are the signs that appear when those need to be changed? I'm asking this because I recently bought one with 300,000 miles on board that produces a ticking noise at idle speed. May these bearings be at fault?
Julian T
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I have to admit that for me the tie breaker and reason I went with a 24 valve was that there are no glow plugs on the 24 valve, yes it does have a air heater which I removed on mine.
But ever since I had a direct injection Isuzu KB 250D which was so much easier to start than the previous model 2.2 it was almost a no brainer for me.
But ever since I had a direct injection Isuzu KB 250D which was so much easier to start than the previous model 2.2 it was almost a no brainer for me.
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Not sure I follow Julian? The 1Hd-t starts on half a turn of the key at any temperature down to -10 (maybe more, I haven’t experienced anything lower) as it is direct injection with added glow plugs which is belt and braces.
The BEBs won't be making a ticking noise. You won't hear a noise from them really until it's too late. You'll hear a loud knocking noise and before you've time to pull over there will be a bang, you'll come to a halt and there'll be 10 litres of black oil running down the road.
There's really no way to know they've been done unless there is some evidence such as a receipt or a note somewhere. You might say that if it's done 300k without failing then it's probably going to be fine. But you simply don't know. If you do one day hear a loud knocking then please park up, switch it off and call for a recovery truck. Don't let them run it up for a listen!
I'd say that out of all the 12vs that I have done or seen done, roughly 80% needed this doing. There's only been a few that had either clearly been done or were perfectly fine.
There's really no way to know they've been done unless there is some evidence such as a receipt or a note somewhere. You might say that if it's done 300k without failing then it's probably going to be fine. But you simply don't know. If you do one day hear a loud knocking then please park up, switch it off and call for a recovery truck. Don't let them run it up for a listen!
I'd say that out of all the 12vs that I have done or seen done, roughly 80% needed this doing. There's only been a few that had either clearly been done or were perfectly fine.
Julian T
Well-Known Member
Granted I have had no experience with the 1HD-T just the 1HD-FT which started no problems in the dead of a Hungarian winter, February 2015 down to -18 one morning, and I was basing my decision on experience with Isuzu engines, I failed to mention I have also had a lot of time driving the 2H fitted to the 40 series in South Africa and that engine could be a right bastard to start on Highvelt winter morning.
Diesels fitted with glow plugs are indirect injection engines with a precombustion chamber in the head where the fuel is sprayed to be heated by the glow plug to aid combustion.
Direct injection diesels do not have a precombustion chamber and spray the fuel directly in to the space available between the top of the piston and the cylinder head.
Very loosely put.
I have always preferred direct injection diesels as they do not have any of the starting difficulties that can be common with glow plug faults.
Not all diesels with glow plugs are indirect injection. My point was that the 1HD-T is a direct injection engine. It has glow plugs fitted also and has no pre combustion chambers in the head. Hence my comment that it was belt and braces.
Julian T
Well-Known Member
I appreciate that, I am biased, I prefer not to have glow plugs due to personal experience.
I don't like them, I think they are unnecessary.
And as additional information I served an apprenticeship on heavy duty diesels working on L and V series Mercedes trucks and plant engines in the late 80's to early 90's in South Africa and Botswana.
I appreciate that, I am biased, I prefer not to have glow plugs due to personal experience.
I don't like them, I think they are unnecessary.
And as additional information I served an apprenticeship on heavy duty diesels working on L and V series Mercedes trucks and plant engines in the late 80's to early 90's in South Africa and Botswana.
I appreciate you have your preferences. I’m simply describing the 1HD-T.
Sweet. That apprenticeship must have been an eye opener.
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Agree on both BEBs and "ticking" - ours seems very particular on oil - even oil of the same grade, on changing will sometimes tick, and sometimes not - haven't established a pattern yet - but 6 years on I've given up worrying. We changed the BEBs on our 24v as a precaution - I know this typically effects 12vs, but for the cost, I figured it worthwhile.
Changed my 12v ones at 150k - perfect , 24 Valve ones at 130 K - like new .
I think more depends on regular servicing and oil/filter changes than if it's 12 or 24 valve .
Would be interested if any 12v engines with known good service records had suffered .
I think more depends on regular servicing and oil/filter changes than if it's 12 or 24 valve .
Would be interested if any 12v engines with known good service records had suffered .
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These are the only set I've ever changed. They are out of my first 80 which I'd had since 2 years old.It was a 95 12V. I changed the oil every 4.5K and used semi synth. These came out at 148k. TBH they were good enough to go back.
Personally I don't believe that changing the oil has much to do with this. I think you could change it every 100 miles and get the problem, or you could leave it until you could stand a spoon up in it and never have a problem. It seems to have been an issue with the shells themselves. It's probably more about oil composition than it is about frequency. I've done two sets on my own vehicles as well as several sets on other people's. I've only had one set come out perfect. This was after 78k miles from new
These were around the 100 and a bit thousand from another.
These were around the 100 and a bit thousand from another.
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Do you think the shells got better quality as time went on Chris?
