Don't like the adverts?  Click here to remove them

80 series stub axle upgrade

The snap ring on the end of the shaft is stop the driveshaft pulling in, as it will try & do under a torque load. I can't remember the exact details but on full lock one way without the snapring you'll see the shaft pull in under load & then the cv isnt in the centreline of the axle pivot point.

I lost a snap ring once & tried it - not good!
 
Not quite with you there Capt.

The snap ring only stops the drive shaft pulling OUT of the CV joint. Once it's assembled there is only a few mm of end float when you pull the drive shaft in and out. The shaft cannot now pull out any more (into the CV) as I have marred the splines at the diff end and it's more or less at full extension into the CV part.

Can you expand a little please?

Chris
 
I think he may be referring to the snapring on the end of the CV (that protrudes from the hub/drive flange) rather than the snapring on the end of the half-shaft sitting inside the CV bell.
 
Ahhh. Right. Thanks AP. Well that is still in place but the CV section still can't go anywhere. Even if I didn't have it as it is being a55 fnurked from behind by the drive shaft.

Chris
 
Holy thread ressurection batman! :D

I'm just about to order all the parts to rebuild the front axle ends and want to make sure I get everything I need before I start. I can't afford to have the truck off the road for more than a few days.

I take it from reading this thread that the only parts I need to do the conversion are the needle roller bearing and the bronze outer ring? Do you think it worth getting a snap ring from Mr T instead of using the HDK ones?

I was going to order all the parts from Milners along with 2 CV Joints. I already have the seals, swivel seals, gaskets, swivel bearings, etc, but can you think of anything else I may need to order before I start? Would you recommend I also do something else while I'm in there? Anything worth checking for wear or deterioration etc?

This is the first time I have had one of these apart so I'm not sure what horrors are awaiting me. If anyone can give me any tips or hints that would be very much appreciated. Oh and if you have any recommendations for greases or oils I should use or steer away from that would be good too. :thumbup:

Thanks in advance.
 
I would do wheel bearings as well bill. Also spare lock washers for bearing nuts is handy as normally not to good.

Karl
 
Don't like the adverts?  Click here to remove them
Thanks Karl I will look at doing them too :thumbup:
 
As Karl said - wheel bearings aren't cheap though, so you might want to inspect when you have the hubs off and if any need replacing, you could put it back together and then replace once you've bought the bearings. It's not a massive job to change out the wheel bearings later.

I would add thrust washers and lock nuts (bearings nuts as Karl called them) as the thrust washers wear quite quickly being soft. The lock nuts are prime candidates for damage from the previous owner using a chisel to loosen and tighten them if he didn't have a big enough socket, so don't be surprised if these look nasty. These are the 54mm nuts that you need your socket/box-spanner for. If they are mangled, you might not get the socket on them and be forced to use a chisel or screw-driver to remove them - in that case, you'd definitely want to put new ones in in order to torque them up properly with a torque wrench. Lock nuts are only a few quid, so worth having some as spares anyway.

If you end up going back into the hub to replace wheelbearings at a later date, you'll be removing the lock nuts, tab washer and thrush washer anyway, so could replace these items then if necessary.

It's probably worth getting some steering arm studs and cone washers as these are often broken or have fallen out - and even if you don't need them now, they're important spares to have and pretty cheap too. Remember to clean the threads of the knuckle housing properly and lock-tite the new ones in ;)

Remember to use moly grease for the CVs! :cool: I'm assuming you'll follow the various guides on here - you will be fine with them! ;)

Cheers,
A
 
Nice one Thanks Andrew. :thumbup:

I have just been looking through all the bits I have accumulated for the LC and have found a packet with lock nuts and tab washers inside that I suddenly remembered I had ordered months ago and promptly forgot all about. I have a habit of adding a number of smaller items, like those, when I order larger items as you never know when they will come in handy. I will probably add them to the order again anyway as its always handy to have that sort of thing in the parts bin.

I will deffo order some cone washers and studs. I may even get a full set to be on the safe side as it has been at least a few years since these were removed so may be a bit stuck :? But again something worth keeping in the parts bin.

Do you see a pattern emerging here?!?! Think its too many years of owning Land Rovers :lol:

I know how expensive Toyota bearings can be as I have to get a pair of rear ones for my Hilux and Mr T wants £96+VAT for one bearing :shock:
 
Bearings can be expensive but can be brought from a bearing supplier far cheaper than main dealer. If you need part numbers give me a shout.

Like andrew said if the bearings are ok then leave them be. I never replace them unless they are needed but there again thats prob why i always have issues :think:

If your stripping down to rebuild though then id do them and keep your old ones as spares maybe.

Karl
 
I have decided to renew the bearings anyway and, as you say Karl, keep my old ones as spares.

Ian has very kindly offered to sell me 2 sets of bearings so I will be going with genuine Mr T. :thumbup:

I have just got off the phone to my mate who is currently floating around on the Bibby Topaz DSV somewhere in the north sea and he has kindly offered to lend me his car while he is away so at no point will I be stranded while the LC is off the road. That takes a bit of pressure off me to get it done in 2 days. :dance:

...just need to swap my insurance over to his minted x-type 4x4 Jag :? :lol:
 
Ecoman said:
That takes a bit of pressure off me to get it done in 2 days. :dance:
Even being your 1st time, you should get both sides done in a full day unless you have a major issue. ;)
 
If we ran a timed event at Lincomb where you had an axle on a bench and you had to strip it and put it back together (properly) working as pair you could do that in half an hour - 45 mins. It's just nuts and bolts. What takes the time is not having a beautiful bench height axle that's been cared for! That very real 45 mins can turn into a full day as Matt and I discovered. Even knowing what you're doing, things can go wrong. CVs that won't come apart. Snap rings that refuse to go in, threads that strip, oil drain plugs that appear to be welded in etc. The beauty of having done it once does mean that taking apart the next time is a snip because YOU put it together in the first place. But it's so worth doing on one of these trucks and worth doing all the way through. If you just do CVs you'll be back to do swivel bearings. Then again to do wiper seals, then again to do oil seals..

I would suggest full disassembly before you try and put one back together. Keep everything tidy and clean parts as you go along so they don't pick up more dirt and you can stop have a wash and change etc then begin again with all nice clean parts. Worth getting a washing up bowl, brushes and a gallon of degreaser if you don't have a parts washer. Matt did a sterling job washing and drying all the bits as I took them off. Reassembly was great. Worth putting two pairs of nitrile gloves on too so that when you are really filthy you can just peel one pair off and keep going. One of those magnetic trays is very useful (or two really) so that all the cone washers etc all stay together. You can stick them in a pot with degreaser as an alternative.

You will need to press the needle rollers and bushes in though. OK you can tap them in probably but pressing is better. You could probably do it sideways in a large vice.

Chris
 
Excellent post Chris thank you :thumbup:

That was my theory also. I didn't want to do half a job as I didn't know what i was going to find when I opened up the swivels. Previous shoddy workmanship and bodged repairs aside, most of the stuff I have removed on this LC before has not been greased or copper slipped before refitting. I am almost anal when it comes to making sure that the job is done correctly and in a way that if it should need doing again in the future there will be significantly less seized fastenings.

I have a whole box of nitrile gloves, a pretty good supply of rags, gallons of degreaser and a decent parts washer so hopefully I'm well armed when it comes to cleaning the components.

I also have access to a hydraulic press (although I'm also thinking this is going to be my next big tool investments) at a friends garage so pressing bearings in will only take a wee trip to bit of the work done. I have budgeted for a whole day per side but now I have the loan of a car it won't be too critical if things don't go to plan. :?
 
OK, last thing is to take the tub of copper slip, go out of your drive, walk to the nearest duck pond and throw it as far as you can. We have said on here many times. Copper ease isn't grease. It copper suspended in a very poor grease as a carrier. The idea is that under hot conditions such as exhausts, the grease dissipates and leaves a film of copper. As a grease it's useless and serves only to attract crap and gum everything up.

Right. Now you're ready.


Chris
 
Don't worry I only use copper slip where it is required ie a thin application on the back of brake pads or where the pads run in the caliper and the like. I would never use it in areas where grease alone would work. Hence why I wrote "greased or copper slipped" ;)
 
Ecoman said:
Don't worry I only use copper slip where it is required ie a thin application on the back of brake pads or where the pads run in the caliper and the like. I would never use it in areas where grease alone would work. Hence why I wrote "greased or copper slipped" ;)
Putting coppaslip near brakes will have pushed Chris over the edge :twisted: Chris, you ok mate? :lol:
 
Sorry but I've always done it and never had an issue and not intending to change now. As I never use it as an actual grease I can't see what the problem is. If I had a ready supply of it I would use aluslip but I don't have a ready supply of it so copper slip is an alternative.

I can see the downfall of using copper slip or aluslip as a grease because once it dries you are only left with a thin coat of a soft metal. However in high temperature applications grease would just boil away anyway leaving no lubrication at all so at least the copper or aluminium deposits offer some level of wear protection.

If it was in an area that was rarely accessed or maintained then I would try to find a better alternative. However, as the brakes are checked, stripped and rebuilt every 6-8000 miles (about 4-6 months for me) the metal deposits are being regularly cleaned off and then applied afresh.

If someone was to offer me an alternative procedure or product then I'm willing to give it a try but unless i see a significant improvement or benefit I will carry on in the same way as I have always done.
 
Andrew. Booked into the clinic for first thing Monday.


Chris
 
Ecoman said:
Don't worry I only use copper slip where it is required ie a thin application on the back of brake pads or where the pads run in the caliper and the like

Most copper slip/copper ease products appear to rot rubber softening it up and causing it to expand - on the back of front pads it leads to the calliper seals softening up and ripping so the muck gets in and when used on the slider bolts in the rear callipers leads to slider bolts being pinched and seals ripping.

Having said that you can't beat it on chassis bolts like the ones holding bash plates when re-assembling - they come out a lot easier next time around.
 
Back
Top