Does the GX have air suspension? http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classif...radius/1500/page/2/postcode/eh549jq?logcode=p
Don't like the adverts? Click here to remove them
Does this have air suspension?
- Thread starter oostsco
- Start date
oostsco
had a quick look at the advert and i think they have made a typo, the title says gx but it has vx on the doors! if its a vx id imagine it has the air suspension and it should have the air suspension buttons on the centre consol.....? open to correction tho....
had a quick look at the advert and i think they have made a typo, the title says gx but it has vx on the doors! if its a vx id imagine it has the air suspension and it should have the air suspension buttons on the centre consol.....? open to correction tho....
Steve Wright
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Mar 4, 2010
- Messages
- 443
- Country Flag
- Joined
- Mar 7, 2010
- Messages
- 2,345
- Country Flag
Don't start that one again, please.
The hydraulic system on a 100 series cruiser is air suspension. That the movement and load is transferred hydraulically doesn't change the air springs into anything else than air suspension. That the globes are filled with nitrogen doesn't change it either, as nitrogen is the main constituent in air.
PS: You can see the buttons for the suspension in front of the gear shift in one of the pics.
Last edited:
Steve Wright
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Mar 4, 2010
- Messages
- 443
- Country Flag
Don't be stupid its not air suspension at all if it was air there would be a air compressor so where is it ?
Please please don't come on here with comments that are a waste of time !
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydropneumatic_suspension
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_suspension
so out of the explanations above which is the nearest to a Toyota 100 series ?
Last edited:
Interesting discussion 
I would say it's hydraulic though. Yes there is nitrogen in the sphere's, but the spheres primary function is damping not supporting the car. If all the nitrogen leaks out the car is still held up but with very poor damping. You could argue it's electric, after all without that electric pump pressurising the system and all those electric valves it wouldn't work at all 
shock absorbers on conventional suspension systems often have nitrogen in them but it doesn't make it air suspension 
P.S. even if it was a GX, they can have AHC.
I would say it's hydraulic though. Yes there is nitrogen in the sphere's, but the spheres primary function is damping not supporting the car. If all the nitrogen leaks out the car is still held up but with very poor damping. You could argue it's electric, after all without that electric pump pressurising the system and all those electric valves it wouldn't work at all shock absorbers on conventional suspension systems often have nitrogen in them but it doesn't make it air suspension P.S. even if it was a GX, they can have AHC.
Last edited:
Don't like the adverts? Click here to remove them
- Joined
- Mar 7, 2010
- Messages
- 2,345
- Country Flag
It is still air suspension. Well, air/steel suspension. It is air holding the car up, not oil. (Except for when the sphere is flat/exhausted). The fact that there is oil transferring the weight/pressure to the sphere doesn't change the fact that it is the gas in the sphere carrying the load. You could put the sphere straight onto the shock and pump up the pressure, but then you wouldn't get the very good and adjustable damping function. (There would have to be a normal shock absorber in, or in addition to, the the hydraulic ram)
Pneumatic means air. Hydropneumatic suspension is hydraulically transferred air suspension. In the Land Cruiser version this is supported by weak steel springs, so it is not a pure hydropneumatic system either.
The oil/fluid is transferring the load and movement, so it is hydraulic; but because it is the gas holding the weight, it is air/gas/nitrogen suspension in the same manner as with air bellows directly on the axle.
There is no need for an air compressor in this system, as there is an oil pump which changes the pressure in the spheres, and that is the pressure of both the oil and the gas.
Anyhow, it's a hybrid system which is quite simple, but with a bit too many parts to be the most reliable suspension system for offroading and expedition touring.
oostco: Did I start something you didn't want at all?
This is completely wrong Jon. The gas sphere is supporting the car, holding the weight that the steel springs do not hold. The hydraulic part of the system is doing the damping through the 16 step valve in the actuators. And it's the movement of the oil in and out of the sphere that makes it possible to do the damping this way. The oil (ahc fluid) is not compressible and follows the movement of the axle's up/down movement in relation to the frame/body exactly, while the gas in the sphere is easily compressible just like a coil spring.
Pneumatic means air. Hydropneumatic suspension is hydraulically transferred air suspension. In the Land Cruiser version this is supported by weak steel springs, so it is not a pure hydropneumatic system either.
The oil/fluid is transferring the load and movement, so it is hydraulic; but because it is the gas holding the weight, it is air/gas/nitrogen suspension in the same manner as with air bellows directly on the axle.
There is no need for an air compressor in this system, as there is an oil pump which changes the pressure in the spheres, and that is the pressure of both the oil and the gas.
Anyhow, it's a hybrid system which is quite simple, but with a bit too many parts to be the most reliable suspension system for offroading and expedition touring.
oostco: Did I start something you didn't want at all?
I think I'll just agree to disagree uHu, some of what you say is correct, some is not.
It is the steel casing of the sphere that is supporting the car not the nitrogen btw.
It is the steel casing of the sphere that is supporting the car not the nitrogen btw.
uHu - looks like I have started it .......... as you all know I am new to this forum but have seen some comments about the other forum, is this it. Have to say I quite enjoyed this "discussion" and my question has been answered in more detail than expected
Great forum
Tobie
Great forum
Tobie
Rob
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Mar 7, 2010
- Messages
- 2,345
- Country Flag
Point taken.
Let me put it another way:
With coil or leaf springs, it's the steel that gives.
With rubber suspension (BL Mini), it's the rubber that has the 'give'.
With air/gas suspension, it's the gas that gives. And that is with or w/o hydraulic transfer.
Rob
Well-Known Member
Well on my Nitrocharger sport shocks the nitrogen gas gives so it must be air suspension (as air is mostly composed of nitrogen), oh wait the gas is kept in the steel casing of the shock absorber so its the casing that is supporting the truck but not does not "give" so it must be err... 
Last edited:
- Joined
- Mar 7, 2010
- Messages
- 2,345
- Country Flag
Yes, it is a good forum.uHu - looks like I have started it .......... as you all know I am new to this forum but have seen some comments about the other forum, is this it. Have to say I quite enjoyed this "discussion" and my question has been answered in more detail than expected
Great forum
Tobie
Most of the time we manage to contribute more in the same direction, but parts of me are more pig-headed than what is good.
Last edited:
.....
Hi
I remember when i served my time , the citroen system was the one everyone dreaded coming ino the workshop , i think the toyo ahc is similar although i cant remember if the citroen was purely hydraulic and not assisting a mechanically undersprung arrangement.
Any way i reckon the toyo ahc side of the suspension is basically hydraulic , but lie some hydraulic circuits has accumulators ( the spheres) fitted to smooth out t he pressure spikes that sudden bumps and vehicle movements generate. to control these spikes purely hydraulically due to the speed of the deflection would require huge oil pipes from the rams and a relief or flow control system to allow the damping and a beefy pump to allow ram replenishment. if you can picture a circuit like that you can see why the nitrogen accumulators simplify what would be complex hydraulic system given the compression properties of a gas .
we use similar offshore for soft starting hyd pumps on rov's , and also winch drive systems to soak transmission spikes , the accumulators also store oil under pressure also so can lift or apply brakes as required too. We just see them as a pretty normal part of a hydraulic circuit.
In saying that a lot of motorcycle shock absorbers have a piggy back nitrogen filled accumulator and they refer to it as gas assisted suspension.
thats my tupenceworth, still dont know why it needs so many wires and computery nonsense though , a pump on off switch and a few isolate solenoids and you could control the height manually, i think the spheres are sized to iron out the bumps.
cheers
greg
I remember when i served my time , the citroen system was the one everyone dreaded coming ino the workshop , i think the toyo ahc is similar although i cant remember if the citroen was purely hydraulic and not assisting a mechanically undersprung arrangement.
Any way i reckon the toyo ahc side of the suspension is basically hydraulic , but lie some hydraulic circuits has accumulators ( the spheres) fitted to smooth out t he pressure spikes that sudden bumps and vehicle movements generate. to control these spikes purely hydraulically due to the speed of the deflection would require huge oil pipes from the rams and a relief or flow control system to allow the damping and a beefy pump to allow ram replenishment. if you can picture a circuit like that you can see why the nitrogen accumulators simplify what would be complex hydraulic system given the compression properties of a gas .
we use similar offshore for soft starting hyd pumps on rov's , and also winch drive systems to soak transmission spikes , the accumulators also store oil under pressure also so can lift or apply brakes as required too. We just see them as a pretty normal part of a hydraulic circuit.
In saying that a lot of motorcycle shock absorbers have a piggy back nitrogen filled accumulator and they refer to it as gas assisted suspension.
thats my tupenceworth, still dont know why it needs so many wires and computery nonsense though , a pump on off switch and a few isolate solenoids and you could control the height manually, i think the spheres are sized to iron out the bumps.
cheers
greg
Graham
Well-Known Member
Interesting topic,
But could i just ask one thing?
Are there any standard, out of the factory, 100 series Land Cruisers, (not 105) that have just a pure coil spring and traditional shock absorber, in each corner, nothing more, to hold the truck up?
That is the question, what year and designation are they.
Gra.
But could i just ask one thing?
Are there any standard, out of the factory, 100 series Land Cruisers, (not 105) that have just a pure coil spring and traditional shock absorber, in each corner, nothing more, to hold the truck up?
That is the question, what year and designation are they.
Gra.
