So, what's everyone's view on using the "super" diesels? When I had a petrol V8 Holden (OK a VXR8 over here) I always used the V-Power stuff and reckoned I got better MPG which just about paid for the increase cost of the fuel. Worth using similar diesel fuels in our Land Cruisers?
Don't like the adverts? Click here to remove them
V-Power Diesel
- Thread starter Lewis07
- Start date
chadr
Well-Known Member
Not sure about the diesels but the Petrol engines apparently need to run on the higher octane fuels for several thousand clicks before the ECU adjusts. So many people, not realising this, give up after one of two tankfuls.
The D-4D isn't an agricultural diesel!! Definitely in the same league as any other modern common-rail high-pressure diesel and should probably be given the best diesel you can. I always use V-Power or BP Ultimate unless I really can't find anything else. But I won't use supermarket diesel - too much crud in it I think.
My tuppence worth
My tuppence worth
Don't like the adverts? Click here to remove them
Sorry Gary - I wasnt clear. By high performance I was referring to specific output (as in hp per litre). Most 4x4 engines are optimised for torque as opposed to power ergo are not as highly stressed and are not operating as close to physical limits of the fuel technology. The power output of a D4D is 173bhp from 3 litres. This is nothing like the 170 bhp from 2.0 litres of for example a Skoda Octavia vRS or 265bhp from the BMW 335d.
Also 4x4 diesels are expected to run up high mileages and be more reliable than the more fragile high output car engines. They are also designed to run on poorer quality fuels as high quality fuels are not available everywhere. To that end there is (IMHO) very little point is spending the extra on expensive diesel fuel.
As for supermarket fuel it all comes from the same refinery and is the same base stock as every other fuel from the same refinery. The differences come from the additive packs added after refining.
I had a Volvo S40 (Ford TDCi powered version) which gave significantly better economy from supermarket fuels than it did Shell or BP and that engine (136bhp from 2.0l) ran no better on v-power than anything else.
Also 4x4 diesels are expected to run up high mileages and be more reliable than the more fragile high output car engines. They are also designed to run on poorer quality fuels as high quality fuels are not available everywhere. To that end there is (IMHO) very little point is spending the extra on expensive diesel fuel.
As for supermarket fuel it all comes from the same refinery and is the same base stock as every other fuel from the same refinery. The differences come from the additive packs added after refining.
I had a Volvo S40 (Ford TDCi powered version) which gave significantly better economy from supermarket fuels than it did Shell or BP and that engine (136bhp from 2.0l) ran no better on v-power than anything else.
Graham
Well-Known Member
As I understand, there is a trade, between long life, or higher power output.
Sure the 3 liter Land Cruiser D4-d churns out 173bhp, and the VW would churn out the same power from 2 liters.
I don't for one minute doubt that the 3 liter D4-d engine isn't capable of more output.
Whether it could raise the output from 57 bhp per liter to 86 bhp per liter as the VW does, I don't know.
If it was capable, than a 3 liter D4-d churning 260 bhp, would be awesome fun.
Gra.
Sure the 3 liter Land Cruiser D4-d churns out 173bhp, and the VW would churn out the same power from 2 liters.
I don't for one minute doubt that the 3 liter D4-d engine isn't capable of more output.
Whether it could raise the output from 57 bhp per liter to 86 bhp per liter as the VW does, I don't know.
If it was capable, than a 3 liter D4-d churning 260 bhp, would be awesome fun.
Gra.
It's only 173 on the older ones iirc. The Invincible variant runs at 200 plus I think. The TTE performance kit, available from your friendly Mr T for a paltry £1000, takes you to over 200bhp without affecting your warranty. And the clunky old 4.2 NA diesel in marine mode puts out nearly double it's vehicular rating, so clearly de-tuned for service life in a 4x4.
I was also under the impression that the supermarket diesel has a lot more veg oil content than say Shell V-Power and obviously none of the unicorn tears additives to clean fuel systems and boost cetane ratings? Could be wrong though ....
I was also under the impression that the supermarket diesel has a lot more veg oil content than say Shell V-Power and obviously none of the unicorn tears additives to clean fuel systems and boost cetane ratings? Could be wrong though ....
interesting comment after a bit of digging:
"If you take a look at a list of refineries you’ll see that there really aren’t that many. So what happens is that standard grade fuels are pumped into each company’s tankers and the quality is the same. The difference comes in the additives that each company adds to its tankers. These might affect performance, so if you feel your car drives better on one type of fuel, keep using it. However, the fuel from different refineries may differ enough to blur any distinction. There are other variables too, but that would take several paragraphs to go into. As for supermarket fuel, it should all be of a minimum quality standard. So how come it is cheaper? There are three possible answers – a more flexible distribution network, fewer (or poorer) additives in the fuel, and thirdly, the fact that the big supermarkets are prepared to discount – they sell lots of things, not just petrol and chocolate bars, so they can afford to make a slight loss in order to attract customers into the stores."
source: http://www.simplemotoring.co.uk/supermarket-vs-branded-fuels/#.UMmlYqytor0
So maybe there's not much in it between supermarket fuel and regular service station fuel? But V-Power and Ultimate seem to have reported MPG improvement figures around the 7.5% mark in long-term use.
Again, all anecdotal - can't seem to find any empirical evidence anywhere on a controlled test to determine what benefits, if any, are attributable to V-Power or Ultimate fuels. And the fuel companies just publish their own version of reality.
So who knows? I do know that Mr T told me when I was going through the injector seal issues that I should certainly abstain from supermarket fuel as they suspected it didn't help the problems observed with leaking seals etc. Maybe that was a good scape-goat though for poor seal design
"If you take a look at a list of refineries you’ll see that there really aren’t that many. So what happens is that standard grade fuels are pumped into each company’s tankers and the quality is the same. The difference comes in the additives that each company adds to its tankers. These might affect performance, so if you feel your car drives better on one type of fuel, keep using it. However, the fuel from different refineries may differ enough to blur any distinction. There are other variables too, but that would take several paragraphs to go into. As for supermarket fuel, it should all be of a minimum quality standard. So how come it is cheaper? There are three possible answers – a more flexible distribution network, fewer (or poorer) additives in the fuel, and thirdly, the fact that the big supermarkets are prepared to discount – they sell lots of things, not just petrol and chocolate bars, so they can afford to make a slight loss in order to attract customers into the stores."
source: http://www.simplemotoring.co.uk/supermarket-vs-branded-fuels/#.UMmlYqytor0
So maybe there's not much in it between supermarket fuel and regular service station fuel? But V-Power and Ultimate seem to have reported MPG improvement figures around the 7.5% mark in long-term use.
Again, all anecdotal - can't seem to find any empirical evidence anywhere on a controlled test to determine what benefits, if any, are attributable to V-Power or Ultimate fuels. And the fuel companies just publish their own version of reality.
So who knows? I do know that Mr T told me when I was going through the injector seal issues that I should certainly abstain from supermarket fuel as they suspected it didn't help the problems observed with leaking seals etc. Maybe that was a good scape-goat though for poor seal design
Found this online calculator: http://www.torquecars.com/tools/annual-fuel-cost-from-mpg.php
Not exactly sure on the mpg and cost differences between the different fuel types, but interesting all the same.
Lorin
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2010
- Messages
- 1,467
Purely anecdotal I know, but my car, a modified 'performance' diesel, used to fairly often go into limp mode when run on supermarket diesel and worked hard. Since changing to the 'super diesels' from BP and Shell it has never occured again. I've run 3 whole tanks of BP Ultimate in the 80 and neither saw nor felt any difference at all. Whereas since adding two-stroke to each tank it is noticeably smoother and less smokey. I haven't checked if any impact on mpg but I doubt it!
Yes Ive seen something similar. Can be quite scarey to see how much we spend on fuel over a year eh!
I put V Power in mine the last time I filled up, seems to run smoother and go slightly better, not so fussed about effect on mpg. On mostly super market pump diesel we averaged 26mpg over 3200 ish miles in the summer, heavily loaded and with the RT up top, mostly motorway cruising. I'm surprised to see such low real world fuel consumption figures for 120's. Taking devaluation into account as well they seem pretty uneconomical to run compared to a good 80 
Andrew T
Member
- Joined
- Mar 18, 2011
- Messages
- 161
- Country Flag
The cheaper supermarket diesel has a higher percentage of biodiesel and hence a lower calorific value, and hence lower mpg.
Your LC will prefer the premium stuff, but with the weight of a LC you will see little difference in power and economy, but in a small lighter car you will see more effect.
The Modern LC has quite a high tech fuel management system and will definitely run better for longer on the premium diesels, but it may take you years to see the difference in wear and tear.
Your LC will prefer the premium stuff, but with the weight of a LC you will see little difference in power and economy, but in a small lighter car you will see more effect.
The Modern LC has quite a high tech fuel management system and will definitely run better for longer on the premium diesels, but it may take you years to see the difference in wear and tear.
Last edited:
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2010
- Messages
- 1,989
- Country Flag
I always run my BMW 335d on VPower and it seemed to average 36mpg.
Recently I have been using cheep Tesco shite, the reason being any excuse to go in and buy the special offer £1.48 (maximum 2 litre per customer) of Castrol Actevo 2T oil which I use in the Land Cruiser.
On Tesco fuel it has dropped to 30mpg
needless to say now the offer has ended, it will be VPower from now on.
Incidentally, adding 500ml of 2t oil to the tank full on the LC has seen the mpg go up from 21'ish to 25
Recently I have been using cheep Tesco shite, the reason being any excuse to go in and buy the special offer £1.48 (maximum 2 litre per customer) of Castrol Actevo 2T oil which I use in the Land Cruiser.
On Tesco fuel it has dropped to 30mpg
needless to say now the offer has ended, it will be VPower from now on.Incidentally, adding 500ml of 2t oil to the tank full on the LC has seen the mpg go up from 21'ish to 25
