Went to look at a job yesterday just off the M40, came off the offslip at a stop junction did a left & quick right which leads to a villiage, it's a dead end road so you have to come back out the same way, did a left & back under the M40 towards the slip to go back up the m/way, just under the m'way tucked up behind a pillar was a speed detector van quick look at speedo & i was around 43 - 44 mph in a 40 limit, i know i know i was over, thing is i was back down there today & there are NO speed camera warning signs between the junction i pulled out of & where the van was hiding, how do you think i would stand if i contested it, there is a sign but it's further up the road from the junction i pulled out of.
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How do you think i stand ?
- Thread starter joinerman
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One thing I have found is that speedometers are always optimistic compared to a Satnav/GPS reading. If your speedo reading was 43-44mph chances are you were nearer 40MPH than you thought, I hope so.
Keep us informed.
Andy
Keep us informed.
Andy
I would be optimistic.
At 80 kph my speedo is bang on the sat-nav, at 120 kph the speedo is about 2 km under and at 50 kph it's about 2 kph over.
On this basis, at 40 mph, your speedo is likely to be reading over your true speed.
Are you in the AA or the RAC? The AA used to give free legal advice and court representation / defence for motoring related charges. It's worth checking out, they saved me from a possible ban on 2 occasions.
Good luck...
At 80 kph my speedo is bang on the sat-nav, at 120 kph the speedo is about 2 km under and at 50 kph it's about 2 kph over.
On this basis, at 40 mph, your speedo is likely to be reading over your true speed.
Are you in the AA or the RAC? The AA used to give free legal advice and court representation / defence for motoring related charges. It's worth checking out, they saved me from a possible ban on 2 occasions.
Good luck...
Craig Yeoman
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Most of the time Ive been ok when on or just over the limit. It may be down to quick braking, a bit of luck or the camera operator having a slow dodgy gammy trigger finger! I also think they are out to catch the blatant offenders whom blaze through at well over the limit. However don't try your luck in the Lincolnshire county area. They prosecute bang on the speed limit- no prisoners, no lee way. We don't send Christmas cards anymore. Good luck, my vote goes to you being ok.
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Neil Stone
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I was driving down the A9 with a cue of traffic behind a white van driving at 50mph.
Nothing coming so I indicated and overtook them all, probably upto about 80 to 85mph "oh no it's a camera van".
I never heard a thing. I guess they only record when hiding in lay-bys.
On the other hand I got caught doing 58mph through roadworks on the M62 (no cars around, no workers, nothing).
The bit I object to is that they referred to it as a 'safety' camera.......did it catch the dangerous driver, the careless driver, the tailgater, the drunk, the drug user or the uninsured......no, thats because it's a feckin speed camera !!
Hope you dont get fined mr Joinerman
Nothing coming so I indicated and overtook them all, probably upto about 80 to 85mph "oh no it's a camera van".
I never heard a thing. I guess they only record when hiding in lay-bys.
On the other hand I got caught doing 58mph through roadworks on the M62 (no cars around, no workers, nothing).
The bit I object to is that they referred to it as a 'safety' camera.......did it catch the dangerous driver, the careless driver, the tailgater, the drunk, the drug user or the uninsured......no, thats because it's a feckin speed camera !!
Hope you dont get fined mr Joinerman
What really anoys me is i got done last sept, 36 mph in a 30, did a speed awareness course & I've been driving like an old granny ever since, one moment of forgetfulness & **** if i have been done i get the previous points that are on ice so to speak, so that will give me 6 points to go with the 3 i got almost 3 years ago.
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You sure about that? I did a speed awareness course 3 days ago and we were told that the offence was now 'wiped'.
As others have said, if you had 44'ish on your speedo you will be fine
Hmmmmmmmm, as i understand it the points are suspended for a certain amount of time, not sure what the length of time is though,
What did you think of the course ? i found it quite interesting & learnt a few things & I've been driving for 45 years now, the time flew by.
What did you think of the course ? i found it quite interesting & learnt a few things & I've been driving for 45 years now, the time flew by.
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Been driving 34 years and found the course akin to watching paint dry.... there were 23 of us there and I was quite shocked by most people's lack of basic knowledge.
On the plus side, the cheese and bacon croissants were delicious and Yorkshire tea was provided
chadr
Well-Known Member
I was caught by a camera, literally 100 yrds from on my doorstep. I was in my Mondeo driving out of my close onto the main road, I thought I felt a slight misfire, so blipped the throttle (road was clear), completely forgetting the camera that I drive past almost everyday!! Was done for doing 34mph in a 30 zone.
I opted for the Speed Awareness Course and there they quite categorically stated that there would be no points and that it wouldn't be on my record. They also that there was no impact on insurance etc. or similar - it would be as if it didn't happen from a records pov.
However, if you get caught again with 3 years (IIRC) you do not have the option to take the course again and will have to accept the points and/or fine for the 2nd offense.
Add : I've just clarified the above sentence, so there is no misunderstanding.
I opted for the Speed Awareness Course and there they quite categorically stated that there would be no points and that it wouldn't be on my record. They also that there was no impact on insurance etc. or similar - it would be as if it didn't happen from a records pov.
However, if you get caught again with 3 years (IIRC) you do not have the option to take the course again and will have to accept the points and/or fine for the 2nd offense.
Add : I've just clarified the above sentence, so there is no misunderstanding.
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So what? Agreed that the tyres will have an effect on the accuracy of the speedo, but I'm comparing it with GPS speed readings.
As mine (and likely others) reads over at lower speeds and under at higher speeds I drew a logical conclusion that Joinerman may not be too much bother.
I got done some time back in the Impreza running late for my brothers wedding in Falmouth at Pendennis Castle as I came over the brow of a hill on Bodmin!!! Flew past the parked up Volvo V70 Jam sandwich and thought 'If I keep my toe in and get past these 5 or 6 trucks and 4 or 5 cars before the dual carriageway runs out he'll not bother perusing me' WRONG!! As i pulled in my rear view mirror was full of blue flashing lights!!!! How TF he got there so quick still evades me?!?! Pulled me over into a view point parking area, we had a chat, he showed me the back of a lazer speed camera and a short video (of me) gave me a ticket and I was on my way. Clocked me from a 1000meters!!!! 3 points and a £60 fine from memory, but I think it's all changed a tad since then. Best thing was the wife slept through he whole thing, even me getting out of the car and spending 10min or more in the back of a Police car!!!
Had nothing since touch wood, but leaving Lincomb this time round as I came off of the first roundabout onto a short section of Dual Carriageway I drove straight toward one of those parked up speed camera vans doing at least 10mph over the limit for that section of road and was so sure I'd be getting something in the post told the wife when I got home. I've not had a thing since, nothing?! I was so sure that something would be on its way as I was convinced that I was over the speed limit for that stretch of road! I guess it's just the luck of the draw at the end of the day. We all speed at some point in every journey and one day each and every one of us will get our collars felt for it.
Since fitting my 255/85/16's my speedo has been bang on across the range when compared to both my GPS navigation devices.
Had nothing since touch wood, but leaving Lincomb this time round as I came off of the first roundabout onto a short section of Dual Carriageway I drove straight toward one of those parked up speed camera vans doing at least 10mph over the limit for that section of road and was so sure I'd be getting something in the post told the wife when I got home. I've not had a thing since, nothing?! I was so sure that something would be on its way as I was convinced that I was over the speed limit for that stretch of road! I guess it's just the luck of the draw at the end of the day. We all speed at some point in every journey and one day each and every one of us will get our collars felt for it.
Since fitting my 255/85/16's my speedo has been bang on across the range when compared to both my GPS navigation devices.
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Found this on tinternet
[h=2]If I get caught speeding again will I get the points and have to pay the fine for the first offence?[/h] [FONT="]No, this is a myth that we sometimes get asked to confirm. If you successfully complete the speed awareness course, you will not have to take the points or pay the fine for the first offence if you get caught speeding again. However, you will have to pay the fine and take the points for the new offence.
This was categorized under Lancashire county council so I'm hoping it's nationwide.
[/FONT]
[h=2]If I get caught speeding again will I get the points and have to pay the fine for the first offence?[/h] [FONT="]No, this is a myth that we sometimes get asked to confirm. If you successfully complete the speed awareness course, you will not have to take the points or pay the fine for the first offence if you get caught speeding again. However, you will have to pay the fine and take the points for the new offence.
This was categorized under Lancashire county council so I'm hoping it's nationwide.
[/FONT]
Neil Stone
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I got offered the speed awareness course, but it was in Yorkshire and I live 10 hours to the North, the fine and points were cheaper !
You can opt to get it transferred nearer to your home, I did, twice.
Neil Stone
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I dont think they offered anything North of the border...........if they did it was Glasgow (5 hours to the South).
If there had have been one a bit closer (say Inverness), I'd have done it rather than the points.
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First off, wait to see if you get a ticket. If not nothing to worry about. There is not spead awareness courses in scotland, you just get the fine and points. As for moving the speed awareness course to home, a lot of police forces do let you do that, but some do not.
Yes, Paul it is like watching paint dry!!
Yes, Paul it is like watching paint dry!!
wobbly
Well-Known Member
Few random bits:
They must serve a Notice of Intended Prosecution (NIP) on the registered keeper of the vehicle within 14 days of the offence. They can issue it on day 14 at the latest, if it gets to you on day 16 its still valid.
So first thing is to wait 14 days - no letter means no prosecution (if its a company van the letter may go to them).
Speed, and allowances:
By law, all new cars speedos must read 5% + 2mph over the actual speed.
This means that at 26mph actual, your speed is showing 29.3mph. So when you are poodling along at exactly 30mph indicated, your speed is a fraction over 26mph.
So in the original scenario, your speedo indicated 44mph, but your actual speed would have been 40mph.
This relies on the vehicle being to manufacturers spec regarding tyre size, so if you have put on larger tyres, the speedo will now under-read, which tends to make the actual speed equal indicated (ie it wipes out the difference).
The generally accepted 'allowance' of 10% is a simplification of the 5%+2mph figure, and is taken as a pragmatic guide by traffic officers - its easy to explain 10% allowance....
In addition, some forces have their own guidelines for Motorways - under an indicated 80mph is not likely to get you a ticket, to establish a sort of common agreement, motorways are policed in 'clusters' where they cross several force boundaries ie around the Midlands, so they have a common Motorway policy.
So a form drops through your letterbox saying you were doing 34mph in a 30 zone......one of the principles for prosecuting what at first looks to be a minimal overspeed relates to the first point regarding how speedos are calibrated. In this example, the actual speed is 34mph, so the speedo would actually be showing an indicated 34+5%+2mph ie 37.7mph. The consensus is that if your speedo is showing 37mph and you are in a 30mph zone, as a competent driver you should notice and slow down accordingly.
The speed awareness courses - ACPO (Police bosses) policy is only one offence in 3 years in England and Wales (Scotland has different laws).
The reason you must attend the course within a certain time limit is that the time limit for prosecution is 6 months from the date of the offence, a summons cannot be issued after 6 months (its called malicious prosecution). This relates to most, but not all, motoring offences, specifically those that can only be tried in a Magistrates Court.
If you modify your vehicle and the speedo is no longer accurate, then you must have it recalibrated. I'm pretty sure this is covered by the Construction & Use Regs. The recalibration can be to actual speed, not the 5%+2mph figure.
Not knowing your true speed ie modifying and not recalibrating, is not a defence. Nor is unknowingly speeding because the vehicle you are driving does not have an accurate speedo, it is always the drivers responsibility, regardless of who the car belongs to - although if it is a company vehicle the employer can also be prosecuted for many offences, as the vehicle is being 'used' on their behalf.
Wear on the tyre, and low air pressure, are not defences, as they make the tyre smaller, not bigger, so your speedo would be over-reading as the diameter gets smaller.
Speedo's and odometers are calibrated differently. The odometer will read the correct distance, regardless of the speedo over-reading.
My 255's give me an under-read of approx. 5%, so at an indicted 30mph my actual speed is 31.5mph, so I tend to drive just under the speed limit, and never more than 65mph indicated (where allowed, not through villages etc!).
My odometer under-reads by 9%.
Both of these figures are consistent with the increase in tyre size.
Graham - you mentioned under-reading at low speed and over-reading at high speed - as both the tyres and the speedo remain a consistent size (I hope..) the difference must be due to some sort of wear in the bit in between, either the cable or the bits at each end they go into.
Pete
They must serve a Notice of Intended Prosecution (NIP) on the registered keeper of the vehicle within 14 days of the offence. They can issue it on day 14 at the latest, if it gets to you on day 16 its still valid.
So first thing is to wait 14 days - no letter means no prosecution (if its a company van the letter may go to them).
Speed, and allowances:
By law, all new cars speedos must read 5% + 2mph over the actual speed.
This means that at 26mph actual, your speed is showing 29.3mph. So when you are poodling along at exactly 30mph indicated, your speed is a fraction over 26mph.
So in the original scenario, your speedo indicated 44mph, but your actual speed would have been 40mph.
This relies on the vehicle being to manufacturers spec regarding tyre size, so if you have put on larger tyres, the speedo will now under-read, which tends to make the actual speed equal indicated (ie it wipes out the difference).
The generally accepted 'allowance' of 10% is a simplification of the 5%+2mph figure, and is taken as a pragmatic guide by traffic officers - its easy to explain 10% allowance....
In addition, some forces have their own guidelines for Motorways - under an indicated 80mph is not likely to get you a ticket, to establish a sort of common agreement, motorways are policed in 'clusters' where they cross several force boundaries ie around the Midlands, so they have a common Motorway policy.
So a form drops through your letterbox saying you were doing 34mph in a 30 zone......one of the principles for prosecuting what at first looks to be a minimal overspeed relates to the first point regarding how speedos are calibrated. In this example, the actual speed is 34mph, so the speedo would actually be showing an indicated 34+5%+2mph ie 37.7mph. The consensus is that if your speedo is showing 37mph and you are in a 30mph zone, as a competent driver you should notice and slow down accordingly.
The speed awareness courses - ACPO (Police bosses) policy is only one offence in 3 years in England and Wales (Scotland has different laws).
The reason you must attend the course within a certain time limit is that the time limit for prosecution is 6 months from the date of the offence, a summons cannot be issued after 6 months (its called malicious prosecution). This relates to most, but not all, motoring offences, specifically those that can only be tried in a Magistrates Court.
If you modify your vehicle and the speedo is no longer accurate, then you must have it recalibrated. I'm pretty sure this is covered by the Construction & Use Regs. The recalibration can be to actual speed, not the 5%+2mph figure.
Not knowing your true speed ie modifying and not recalibrating, is not a defence. Nor is unknowingly speeding because the vehicle you are driving does not have an accurate speedo, it is always the drivers responsibility, regardless of who the car belongs to - although if it is a company vehicle the employer can also be prosecuted for many offences, as the vehicle is being 'used' on their behalf.
Wear on the tyre, and low air pressure, are not defences, as they make the tyre smaller, not bigger, so your speedo would be over-reading as the diameter gets smaller.
Speedo's and odometers are calibrated differently. The odometer will read the correct distance, regardless of the speedo over-reading.
My 255's give me an under-read of approx. 5%, so at an indicted 30mph my actual speed is 31.5mph, so I tend to drive just under the speed limit, and never more than 65mph indicated (where allowed, not through villages etc!).
My odometer under-reads by 9%.
Both of these figures are consistent with the increase in tyre size.
Graham - you mentioned under-reading at low speed and over-reading at high speed - as both the tyres and the speedo remain a consistent size (I hope..) the difference must be due to some sort of wear in the bit in between, either the cable or the bits at each end they go into.
Pete
