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pitman arm ball joint just snapped..
- Thread starter chapel gate
- Start date
Not a problem.
regards
Dave
EDIT: Just been told it should be with me tomorrow but, we are in the middle of the TWO WEEK carnival.............no honest.
So if he can get near here early enough all should be well. Early afternoon most of the local roads including approaches get closed, there is no way he will lug that DL through town, it is too heavy.
regards
Dave
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Replacement drag link arrived this morning brilliant customer service thus far. At first looked the same as the one I have, then I could see the drag link threaded ends were slightly shorter, this allows the TRE's to be wound further on to the link, thus it becomes the 2cm shorter I needed to keep my steering wheel straight. The tapers whilst still long did fit nicely into the steering arms allowing the split pins to go in, again that is good. My only thought at the moment is the distance the ball joints are away from the steering arms. I am thinking that, as these links are designed for extreme use, the manufacturers have allowed the additional distance to allow for serious articulation, this would prevent the joints binding and also protect the rubber covers from pinching. I doubt I would be going down that road in the future, but I have contacted the suppliers and sent pictures and asked for their thoughts/opinions.
regards
Dave
regards
Dave
This sounds good Dave, nothing you've just described would worry me, I think you've cracked it, if that's not a poor choice of words 
Did you post a link to your supplier Dave? I've had a trawl back through the thread, but I don't see one. Could be useful for members (or me) in the future.
I do medium stress offroad, so may not need extreme stuff, but there are occasions I'm thinking "maybe somethings gonna give"
Last time I knocked out a CV, I lashed out on chromoloy drive shafts and CVs, and although they're only a few thousand kilometers in use, so far they're smooth and silent, just the way we like 'em to be
Did you post a link to your supplier Dave? I've had a trawl back through the thread, but I don't see one. Could be useful for members (or me) in the future.
I do medium stress offroad, so may not need extreme stuff, but there are occasions I'm thinking "maybe somethings gonna give"
Last time I knocked out a CV, I lashed out on chromoloy drive shafts and CVs, and although they're only a few thousand kilometers in use, so far they're smooth and silent, just the way we like 'em to be
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@ Clive, post with link was #35 but just for you a nice new fresh one. 
http://www.euro4x4parts.com/parts/u...rag_link_chromoly_4140_euro4x4parts_at07.html
regards
Dave
http://www.euro4x4parts.com/parts/u...rag_link_chromoly_4140_euro4x4parts_at07.html
regards
Dave
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@ Clive, post with link was #35 but just for you a nice new fresh one.
http://www.euro4x4parts.com/parts/u...rag_link_chromoly_4140_euro4x4parts_at07.html
regards Dave
Sorry mate, my Mrs always says I never look for stuff properly
Thanks for the fresh re-post
No problem Clive, got to send up some pics for Mark but the site won't play, will try again tomorrow. Carnival party calling now woohoo! As an asides our little town hit 26 C yesterday hottest place in Spain a new record....right where are my swimming trunks 
regards
Dave
regards
Dave
No problem Clive, got to send up some pics for Mark but the site won't play, will try again tomorrow. Carnival party calling now woohoo! As an asides our little town hit 26 C yesterday hottest place in Spain a new record....right where are my swimming trunks
Bit envious of that Dave, I'm 15 minutes from a ski resort with near perfect snow and piste conditions, with a bad back!
Otherwise the weather is now drizzly and 0 - 3 degrees. Actually, just right for some fun on the mountain tracks below the snow line.
Where's my keys?
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So daves lost his trunks and you've lost your keys, please dont tell me any more...
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just shown it my father, a retired old school diesel mechanic. he tells me hes never seen one snap before, hes seen them pop out through being completly worn, and when one went on a triumph vitesse he was driving had to drive all the way back to the workshop in reverse..
I would have liked to have cut mine down the middle with an angle grinder just to see what had made it seize solid (didn't have one back then when it snapped).
It's hard to imagine a joint so seized it would break the pin...
It's hard to imagine a joint so seized it would break the pin...
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The old Ford Console ones were hung "upside down" and used to drop off. I was following one once, my Dad driving, and I thought the driver had thrown a fag end out. Sparks everywhere and then he was all over the road but did not crash. 1956 and no traffic in those days.
Hopefully these pictures are going to come up ok?
OK, the first is obvious, the larger area of the taper which does remain exposed, I am assuming the wider cross section is to regain strength given the distance from the steering arm. The first one delivered was too wide to allow enough of the threaded section to expose the hole for the split pin.
To the second picture, the tape was there to confirm TRE length when I had a fitting issue, it turns out the TRE length is not the problem, it is the amount of the threaded bar that enters the slot before tightening. The first bar sent to me had an extra 1cm here at each end, the threaded portion 'bottomed out' before the overall length was short enough to match my OE bar, the result was the steering wheel was off by about half a turn!
Third shows my concern as to why there is so much of the taper exposed, I do not mean to the elements but, more from an engineering point of view, the additional length allows additional leverage against the ball joint, I am surmising here that the additional thickness of the taper is to counter any weakness in this area? I also assume this prevents binding on the more extreme modified vehicles? I am waiting on a reply from the suppliers about this and hope to get back to you guys as soon as I have an answer.
The final picture shows the taper in and the split pin goes all the way home, it also shows the rubber boot extends to cover the exposed taper, the joints need to be greased before using, I pumped just enough to fill the boot until it reached the steering arm.
I know this thread started by Mike was about a broken ball joint, and hope he does not mind my somewhat anal remedy to prevent the same failure affecting my car and also inform others of the options and the pitfalls they may meet.
regard
Dave
OK, the first is obvious, the larger area of the taper which does remain exposed, I am assuming the wider cross section is to regain strength given the distance from the steering arm. The first one delivered was too wide to allow enough of the threaded section to expose the hole for the split pin.
To the second picture, the tape was there to confirm TRE length when I had a fitting issue, it turns out the TRE length is not the problem, it is the amount of the threaded bar that enters the slot before tightening. The first bar sent to me had an extra 1cm here at each end, the threaded portion 'bottomed out' before the overall length was short enough to match my OE bar, the result was the steering wheel was off by about half a turn!
Third shows my concern as to why there is so much of the taper exposed, I do not mean to the elements but, more from an engineering point of view, the additional length allows additional leverage against the ball joint, I am surmising here that the additional thickness of the taper is to counter any weakness in this area? I also assume this prevents binding on the more extreme modified vehicles? I am waiting on a reply from the suppliers about this and hope to get back to you guys as soon as I have an answer.
The final picture shows the taper in and the split pin goes all the way home, it also shows the rubber boot extends to cover the exposed taper, the joints need to be greased before using, I pumped just enough to fill the boot until it reached the steering arm.
I know this thread started by Mike was about a broken ball joint, and hope he does not mind my somewhat anal remedy to prevent the same failure affecting my car and also inform others of the options and the pitfalls they may meet.
regard
Dave
IMO a good effort Dave, but I don't understand why there's so much exposed taper on that joint.
I don't agree with your valiant attempt to explain it by saying the added thickness of taper gives it more strength. The weakest part of the taper is the exposed thinnest part, so getting thicker toward the ball joint won't help.
It still looks wrong to me, but in a much less critical way than the first bar. I would query it again using your photos, but if they come up blank, I wouldn't hesitate to use it.
I love the idea of greasable units, especially as that may prevent the op (and my) problem of a seizing joint.
I don't agree with your valiant attempt to explain it by saying the added thickness of taper gives it more strength. The weakest part of the taper is the exposed thinnest part, so getting thicker toward the ball joint won't help.
It still looks wrong to me, but in a much less critical way than the first bar. I would query it again using your photos, but if they come up blank, I wouldn't hesitate to use it.
I love the idea of greasable units, especially as that may prevent the op (and my) problem of a seizing joint.
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No worries dave, interesting stuff, carry on.
Funnily enough the tapered conecting bolt on the ome steering damper wouldnt fully seat.
Funnily enough the tapered conecting bolt on the ome steering damper wouldnt fully seat.
I hear you Clive, I know this bar is marketed towards 'extreme use' so I am thinking.......... if you look at a vehicle with say a 4" lift then the drag link would be at quite a severe angle before any additional angle applied during articulation when the angle would increase even further. So, the distance from the ball joint allows that articulation without pinching or binding.......I guess? Meaning if the taper is longer, then the leverage applied to the longer area during normal use is offset by the thicker metal. I agree the area where the taper enters the steering joint has to be the same as the OE unit, so unless the metal is a better grade then the breakage could still occur if there was a seizure, hopefully going under with the grease gun during my OTT oil changes will stop that happening. 
Having said all that, I recall many years ago I fitted 'rose' joints to a beach buggy built for completion use, these allowed for the articulation but, they did not look particularly strong so would they be more appropriate for our use?
Cheers Mike for backing the unintentional hijack. Re the damper, there is a bracket for the damper that comes with a longer bolt to replace the pinch bolt on one of the TRE's, the damper fits it perfectly. The bracket allows the ball joint of the damper to operate at pretty much any angle you wish. I am again using that to bolster my thoughts about severe articulation, also it seems the damper can be dispensed with if need be, the drag link comes without the bracket fitted, an additional hardware bag is supplied.
Hopefully hear from the supplier later today?
regards
Dave
Having said all that, I recall many years ago I fitted 'rose' joints to a beach buggy built for completion use, these allowed for the articulation but, they did not look particularly strong so would they be more appropriate for our use?
Cheers Mike for backing the unintentional hijack. Re the damper, there is a bracket for the damper that comes with a longer bolt to replace the pinch bolt on one of the TRE's, the damper fits it perfectly. The bracket allows the ball joint of the damper to operate at pretty much any angle you wish. I am again using that to bolster my thoughts about severe articulation, also it seems the damper can be dispensed with if need be, the drag link comes without the bracket fitted, an additional hardware bag is supplied.
Hopefully hear from the supplier later today?
regards
Dave
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Useful pics Dave. Thanks.
Is the thread on the bar the same as standard? Just wondering as I have a concern that the extra length of that taper reduces the strength of the assembly. I say that only because normally the shorter the distance between two fixed points on a bar the harder it is to bend it or shear it between those two points. Here those two points are the centre of the taper in the arm and the centre of the rose joint. It's a bit like levering a rock out of the ground: rock at one end, lever point a few inches away and human on the end of the bar, small distance between points needs loads of effort. Not sure if all that makes sense. Either way, I expect that TRE was for a much thicker steering arm.
Is the thread on the bar the same as standard? Just wondering as I have a concern that the extra length of that taper reduces the strength of the assembly. I say that only because normally the shorter the distance between two fixed points on a bar the harder it is to bend it or shear it between those two points. Here those two points are the centre of the taper in the arm and the centre of the rose joint. It's a bit like levering a rock out of the ground: rock at one end, lever point a few inches away and human on the end of the bar, small distance between points needs loads of effort. Not sure if all that makes sense. Either way, I expect that TRE was for a much thicker steering arm.
