Please help me decide ....

[Gary Stockton]

This may be a bit of a surprise, but ...

I'm seriously considering selling my 120 and getting a fairly decent, '96 or '97 manual UK 80 series TD. Not (too) fussed whether its called an Amazon, VX, GX or GS, as long as I know what I'm getting (GS would be nice purely for the stupid reason that those are my initials ). An AirCon and locking diffs are a must, as is a motor that won't drop out or transmission or drive-train that's about to fail - the rest is up for grabs.

I don't think I can explain my thinking - I can't even explain it to myself, let alone SWAMBO or anyone else. Yes, I know I've done a lot to the 120, and it owes me nothing and I can convert it back to almost standard without a heck of a lot of effort. But I can't stop hankering after an 80 (having had 2 already) and I don't think I'd be allowed both

So, firstly, can someone explain to me the differences in UK variants, besides the obvious leather trim not being in the GX and no aircon on a GS.

Secondly, am I being a complete idiot (only with respect to this scenario please ) - the 120 is paid for, is 'only' 7 years old and has low mileage (only just hit 52k miles), is a capable off-road vehicle, is probably easier to drive on-road from a comfort point of view, but has more electrickery stuff, is not as heavy-duty and just seems to be slightly 'softer'. Or is that my imagination playing with me?

But any 80 series I look at will be at least 15 years old with triple the mileage on it ... and things will be starting to go wrong, and who knows what the real vehicle history is. I've had this 120 for 4 years now and it's just come off warranty, so I know its history pretty damn well ...

I don't want to go all "Chris Jerman" and have 37" tyres crunching away over Lincomb mountains and ripping side-mouldings off, etc. but do want to be able to stick on after-market bits to enable and facilitate a decent vehicle-dependent holiday somewhere remote without having to compromise too much. The 120 is just that little bit smaller internally, with a badly-shaped tail, to allow decent fitting-out. For e.g. - I can't find decent long-range fuel tanks for the 120, and fitting water tanks is a pain - they have to go inside, and I don't want to lug full jerry cans around with me, besides being a theft hazard they smell and if they go on the roof-rack they alter the CoG quite a lot.

I think the laning issue ito size is rapidly becoming moot - lots of lanes are closing and I don't think that particular activity will last much longer (and Scotland has no lanes anyway - land law is totally different here).

The 120 D-4D seems to only really like decent diesel too - so African 500ppm diesel and dirty diesel may be an issue, while I think the 80 series may just run on Zambesi water with an oil slick on top

I don't use the LC as a daily-driver, only for trips and trails (and not many of those either) or long-distance travelling within the UK (e.g. to Skye, Cornwall, etc.) so it's not fuel cost I'm terribly concerned about - more capability and comfort over mod-cons.

Lots of the stuff I've done to the 120 will transfer across to an 80 pretty readily - even, I think, the roof-rack. Only the ASFIR plates and suspension would need to stay - and even that can come off if I have to.

So - I'm in a quandary, any advice (even the name of a good shrink) appreciated

And no, I don't want a 150 thanks!

There's a song here somewhere - should I stay or should I go ....

 

[oostsco]

Hi Gary

You know my situation - i am still looking for a LC so i cannot give you any advice - i am more interested in the replies.

Since you have raised the concern about the age of an 80 why are you not interested in a 100. It does not have the solid front axle but will give you everything else you are looking for - just asking?

 

[AndyCook]

nooooo!

you won't fit down those narrow lanes anymore!

 

[Gary Stockton]

The 100s are still a but too expensive - if I sell the 120 and get an 80 I'll have a few bucks for bits. But if I get a decent 100 I won't. I think

 

[karl webster]

I know we have poke gary and from where i was stood you just have the 80 thing in your blood. I dont understand what it is with the 80s but i deal with alot of people who move on from them and end up going back. I had a chap ring me couple of weeks ago.He had a 80 a fews year ago moved onto different motors inc the new rangerover and other 4x4s and hes now going back to the 80. I know you say about the milage that one of the trucks you would end up with but i wouldnt concern yourself to much with that. The 80s are far different than some of the other cruisers IMHO. Alot of the newer cruisers will be dead and burried long before the 80 dies.

So my opinion.Get one brought!!!!!!!!!!! Its better than money in the bank.

Karl

 

[karl webster]

If you buy a 100 Gary it will only be a matter of time before you want a 80 again...................JW!!!!

 

[Andrew T]

Andy c

Gary's gone mad !!

buy his 120 quick !!

Gary
where is the 80 going to take you where your 120 won't ?

as you said the 80's are capable but OLD ! Most on the market are tired and the good ones are kept forever so buy carefully !

and to quote our conversation, just how much stuff do you need to travel with that a 120 won't carry ?

anyway choose wisely and dont give up a great 120 without careful consideration

good luck
cheers
A

ps I'll have a pint of what ever that was you were drinking when you came up with the idea

 

[Gary Stockton]

yes I sometimes think I'm on something weird. Call it a mid-life crisis.

Maybe I'll just get a Porsche boxster and have some fun in that on weekends!!

 

[Michael A S]

Gary - go for an 80 VX. I did a lot of research in the last year and bought a VX, having had Defenders for years. The 80 VX has all you need. With upgraded suspension, leather seats (all electronic) and aircon I just did 1500 miles around spain from motorway to serious offroad in great comfort. The real point about an 80 of that age (mine is a '95) is that is has a simple, proven 4.2 TD donk which has a great track record and no electronics to let you down on a trip away from the AA. Its also made of serious grade proper steel is built like that brick houseand can easily take an extra fuel tank underneath. If you have any further doubts talk to Julian V at Overland Cruisers.

 

[SpinDrift]

must be a bit of a bug around with people changing their cruiser

For a long time I had considered changing from the 90 to an 80. The draw back I saw with the 80 was the age and high milage with possible associated problems. Yes everything or most things can be fixed, but I didnt want to spend time and money just getting to a good starting point. So in the end I got the 100. It is big, and I can see it being a bit of a struggle on some of the lanes, but the extra carying space, the extra power and the comfort make a big difference. I am, maybe naively, not so worried about the electronics in the 100. I think they are pretty reliable.

Good luck with the change.

Oh, and not everthing in life has to be explained and sometimes you have to stop thinking and just do it.

 

[Chris]

80's rock. End of. Gary can't fault your logic (?) Just staggered that it's taken you this long to come to your senses!

Obviously, I have first dibs on any nice ones that come along, that's just unwritten law, but I am sure we can find you one. I am not so sure that 100s are much different in price, especially if you go with std spring set up.

One thing I would say though, given your limted miles is - don't dismiss a petrol. Ja Ja, we have had this debate every which way, but for the money, petrols are usually better condition, lower mileage and with the price of benzene being less than that of oil, the difference between the running costs are minimal. Forget fitting gas, go straight petrol. Also think about the service intervals, dicky injectors, fuel pumps etc that the old derv burners suffer from. If you aren't going to monster the thing like mine, then petrol is not such a daft choice. I take the point that if you get a 24volt manual then you may be touching high 20's maybe even knocking on the door of 30, but the petrol driving experience as you know is gorgeous. I am looking at a couple of cloth 80s at the second. Tidy up to a point, going for nearly £10k. I am also looking at some immaculate petrols at half that at least. It's a lot of money to spend on fuel and toys.

Chris

 

[Paul_Humphreys]

nooooo!

you won't fit down those narrow lanes anymore!

An 80 series will fit anywhere you can put a 120. Most lanes are Land Rover with anyway. Am 80 (with the wheel arches removed) is only just wider that a 110 LR, no longer and a lower roof!!

Paul

 

[ram]

Noooooooo not a boxter please, at least get a 911s4, it's the proper porsche.

 

[Brett]

Don't discount the GS Gary some do have aircon (it was an optional extra) mines got it. Plus the cloth seats survive better than the leather, one piece windows in the rear, no 3rd row seats and no VC in the transfer box. It's all good!

 

[TonyP]

What about maintenance that is bound to be required on an older 80? Are you going to do this yourself of have to sub it out to someone else to do? Will either cost you time or money....

 

[Chris]

In terms of maintenance though Tony, once it fixed up, why would it require more maintenance? Or were you commenting on Gary's (in) ability

If driven in a fairly normal regime, which is what he is saying, then it's just oils and brake pads isn't it? Once on top of it, they're not any trouble to keep right.

Chris

 

[TonyP]

Bit of both I suppose Chris, its the initial work to get everything baselined and up to a good level, and then any ongoing stuff that might need doing on a older vehicle. And yes that takes some skill, and I wont dare to comment on Gary's abilities.

 

[Rob]

So, firstly, can someone explain to me the differences in UK variants, besides the obvious leather trim not being in the GX and no aircon on a GS.

The difference between the GX and VX is cloth on the GX, no sunroof on most and less speakers. I think that is it. My VX has AC climate control, cruiser control, electric windows all round and electric mirrors. The GS has less stuff than the GX, usually no air con.

IMO AC is a must, but make sure it is working. If you are planning big trips then you really don't want to to be driving in 40+ deg c heat without it.

The 80 is old there is no denying it and it will have age related issues. But the old skool manual with the 4.2 turbo lump will put a huge smile on your face every time you drive it (just don't ruin it with iron man coils...). Every time you step into it you get this feeling of unstopability, am as JW pointed out people will just get out of your way. More so than in a 100. And you get to look down to RR drivers which is great. Its a difficult feeling to explain, I have driven a 100 (Lexus diesel) which is more refined and it just does not give you the same feeling. Maybe it was because it is an auto or the air suspension I do not know. Like you said its really difficult to explain why we like the 80 so much, on paper the 100 is better at everything apart from extreme off road so you should really be getting one of those but I can't recommend one.

One thing is for certain, even though I do not use my 80 often, sometimes for weeks at a time or the the fact that the drivers seat does not go back far enough, the wind noise, unrefined ride and the almost non-existent 2nd gear synchromesh when cold I cannot see myself getting rid of it for at least another decade, and by that point I may as well run it into the ground which I expect will be a very long time if I keep on top of the rust (I am talking about 25 year old 300k miles rust).

Sell the 120 and get yourself a real LC

 

[Chris]

Ahh, I see what you're saying Tony. Not so much maintenance as fixing things that break. There really isn't much important stuff on an 80 that outside of regular servicing, falls over. OK so the clock packs up, just look at your watch. Central locking packs up, use the key. As long as it starts, goes and stops, the rest just doesn't matter. And those things are very very basic bits.


In terms of driving mine, I have just done Scotland and back in mine with nothing more than swapping the 37s for my 35's. It wafted along. Actually incredibly quiet, just a nice thruuum from the engine. No wind noise, no tyre noise. Very very surprising for a truck in this modified condition. OK I missed the ARBs this time, lots of roundabouts on the A75. But hey - I even got some off roading in!

Chris

 

[Towpack]

Don't discount the GS Gary some do have aircon (it was an optional extra) mines got it. Plus the cloth seats survive better than the leather, one piece windows in the rear, no 3rd row seats and no VC in the transfer box. It's all good!

The '97 GX models had 8 seats, air con, rear sliding windows and a VC but the VX had in addition:

Leather seats all round (cloth in GX) with electric adustment on fronts (manual in GX)
Burr walnut door cappings and centre console
Chrome roof bars
Colour keyed bumpers
Electric sliding glass sunroof