Relative poverty

[jibberjabber]

Cheers JJ. I bought my first place 25 years ago, and you're right, we were very lucky back then, that this was achievable. But it still took a lot of work, mind.

GOB - The original post was made with the intention of prompting discussion; I don't subscribe to the idea that what is happening in the US or indeed everywhere else around the world, is positive, and I'm not blaming anyone; my main point was that starting from a poor background does not prevent you from getting a decent education and working hard.

I bought my first place 25 years ago

Oh, you 'are' a 'whipper snapper' then.

 

[Shayne]

my main point was that starting from a poor background does not prevent you from getting a decent education and working hard.

Aye whip a kid long enough and hard enough because his mother can't afford to buy him school uniform and he will learn something anyway .

For kids wealth and poverty have no bearing on stability or lack of it . More than once i arrived home from school only to find i didn't live there no more , no note or anything just everything gone and the door locked .

First time i hung about wondering if anyone would remember to come and get me and so ended up sleeping in a bus shelter . Next time i walked 6 miles to my best mates house because his mum was an alcoholic so she wouldn't even know if i stayed the night .

Lessons Victorian or otherwise are not necessary in that walk of life if you need it you gotta work out how to get it on your own . Maybe that's why i know so many who ended up in prison again and again until they consider it home .

 

[jibberjabber]

Aye whip a kid long enough and hard enough because his mother can't afford to buy him school uniform and he will learn something anyway .

For kids wealth and poverty have no bearing on stability or lack of it . More than once i arrived home from school only to find i didn't live there no more , no note or anything just everything gone and the door locked .

First time i hung about wondering if anyone would remember to come and get me and so ended up sleeping in a bus shelter . Next time i walked 6 miles to my best mates house because his mum was an alcoholic so she wouldn't even know if i stayed the night .

Lessons Victorian or otherwise are not necessary in that walk of life if you need it you gotta work out how to get it on your own . Maybe that's why i know so many who ended up in prison again and again until they consider it home .

Sounds like you've had a hard life, and it's left a scar :-(

 

[Shayne]

Nah i had it better than many , all in it just made me who i am and i did ok . I guess the point i'm trying to make is before you judge anybody walk a mile in their shoes . I find it very easy to imagine being any of those people in the field hospital because life taught me that dedication , determination and effort are all worthless if luck isn't on your side .

We all gamble on luck and lady luck can be a fickle mistress .

 

[jibberjabber]

Nah i had it better than many , all in it just made me who i am and i did ok . I guess the point i'm trying to make is before you judge anybody walk a mile in their shoes . I find it very easy to imagine being any of those people in the field hospital because life taught me that dedication , determination and effort are all worthless if luck isn't on your side .

We all gamble on luck and lady luck can be a fickle mistress .

field hospital? were you a medic?

 

[Shayne]

My school was built 1979 and had its own dental surgery inside , his butchery skills were sufficient enough to convince me an abscess or two was just an inconvenience when compared to the very idea of visiting a dentist for maybe 20 years .

I truly didn't care it was just normal , but when the mrs finally convinced me to get my teeth fixed because i had time and i could afford to it didn't go unnoticed by me how many people said i smile more now . So i guess deep down in a place i never looked i was ashamed of them and subconsciously hid them ?

Last month i had them drill out an old filling and cap a dead tooth , no anesthetic and it was about as unpleasant as biting my nails because this guy actually has skills and it only cost me £500 to access them .

I suppose nurses all have good teeth , or should they work harder for that privilege ?

 

[jibberjabber]

I suppose nurses all have good teeth , or should they work harder for that privilege ?

My old Gran used to say "you enjoy your school days, best days of you life' then she'd say "tuck you shirt in, you'll regret it latter in life" then "get bricks and motrtar around you, and you'll never be poor"

My school wad built 1890, it was pulled down about 10 years ago :-(

I think nurses in general have good teeth, as being in nursing they see the consequences of not looking after teeth, dental nurses especially have good teeth as they probably get staff discount.

If you need a lot of dental work, then nurse or not, it might be worth working overtime to pay for the extra dental work needed.

Have a nice day

 

[Shayne]

Hope you don't think i'm feeling sorry for myself , far from it , i'm just saying life's like that .

How do you care for your teeth other than brushing them when you have been taught/hospitalized as a kid by butchers masquerading as dentists ?

Ironically i broke my first tooth while chewing my toothbrush handle in prison , but that was because i'd previously broke my jaw and my teeth had been sewn together with wire to let the bone set . Every dentist i've mentioned this to since asked if i was born in the dark ages .

But no i was born in the Isle of Man which as far as i'm aware still has at least one primary school that actually separates rich/poor connected or not kids into two classes , one set starts learning to read and write on day one while the other gets to colour with crayons for the first year .

A friend was killed by the kid who's parents were both teachers and also freemasons , he overtook on the brow of a hill bend while she was coming the other way on a motorbike . But because he had half an idea to join the navy and now couldn't because he had a criminal record that was thought punishment enough .

Don't tell me that guy made his own luck because i'd have got 6 or 7 years in prison had i done what he did . I was born a rebel and so i rebelled against what is accepted by millions as normal and eventually i won , but that doesn't help the rest .

 

[jibberjabber]

Hope you don't think i'm feeling sorry for myself , far from it , i'm just saying life's like that .

How do you care for your teeth other than brushing them when you have been taught/hospitalized as a kid by butchers masquerading as dentists ?

Ironically i broke my first tooth while chewing my toothbrush handle in prison , but that was because i'd previously broke my jaw and my teeth had been sewn together with wire to let the bone set . Every dentist i've mentioned this to since asked if i was born in the dark ages .

But no i was born in the Isle of Man which as far as i'm aware still has at least one primary school that actually separates rich/poor connected or not kids into two classes , one set starts learning to read and write on day one while the other gets to colour with crayons for the first year .

A friend was killed by the kid who's parents were both teachers and also freemasons , he overtook on the brow of a hill bend while she was coming the other way on a motorbike . But because he had half an idea to join the navy and now couldn't because he had a criminal record that was thought punishment enough .

Don't tell me that guy made his own luck because i'd have got 6 or 7 years in prison had i done what he did . I was born a rebel and so i rebelled against what is accepted by millions as normal and eventually i won , but that doesn't help the rest .

I for one don't think your feeling sorry for you self, I think you are just following the ethos of 'The Lounge' just as I was in replying to your rhetorical question about nurses teeth and weather they should work harder.

I find the snippits of you life quite interesting, and brave of you to post them, so I will ammend my post #23 "Sounds like you've had a hard life", to 'Sounds like you've had an interesting life'.

TTFN.

 

[David]

Have spent a good 10 days in Romania with Shayne he certainly is very interesting in a good way

 

[Shayne]

What - i was thirsty and there was water on the window

 

[Chas]

Have spent a good 10 days in Romania with Shayne he certainly is very interesting in a good way

Me too!

 

[Beau]

Here's my view, having just turned 25.

It's easy to think on paper financially times are more difficult for us newer generation now than 20 years ago, but don't we also have more opportunities now? A University Degree is virtually plausible for every kid. There are other programs available for those who want trade schools instead. Sure, be smart about it. Don't go study 3 years of Art at Uni and expect a job after it. Having seen many of my friends graduate with Business, engineering, health care degrees, they're all doing mostly well. Sure, you're not going to be able to buy a house in London, but there are other surrounding areas. It is HARDER when you compare wages back then to now, vs house prices. But it's not impossible.

The difference I see among my peers are financial habits, and this is generic so I don't mean to offend anyone's kid. But they want the latest iphone, latest watches, New Cars and the latest clothes. They go out, splurge on restaurants, live week by week by what they get. I could go on, but I hope you see my point.

A little on me - I've had the same Iphone 4 for 8 years now. I pretty much took over the cruiser from my dad as my first car. As a kid, I saved every penny. Once at age, all my money went into a ISA. I used to buy a ton of parts/wheels off Ebay and re-sell for in excess of 100% return. I learnt many trades from my father, youtube and books and did side jobs making cash whenever I could. I believe anyone has it in them to get themselves out of poverty.

 

[Shayne]

Having a base to start from is surely a vital ingredient .

 

[goodoldboy]

believe anyone has it in them to get themselves out of poverty.

Education can be a way out but for the poor but it's a lottery.Working class kids with 1st class degrees will earn less than their middle class counterparts who get a 2:1 from Oxbridge.A nephew of mine graduated last year but without his parents money he wouldn't have been able to do the internship that was part of his course.
Having a Landcuiser for your 1st car isn't exactly a sign of privilege but it does say something about where you started from Beau.

 

[Beau]

Totally get where you're coming from and unfortunately we live in a society/world where hard work doesn't equally translate to success or wealth. But I also see a lot of people who trap themselves in this poverty by life choices they make. And this doesn't set there children up for great success. The Book "Rich Dad, Poor Dad" translates this very well.

Maybe I'm a little harsh on some of my peers but I was just brought up to never say anything was impossible, or give up. I put myself through University with 3 part time jobs at one point. Side construction work, mentoring, mechanic work, flipping car parts and cars through craigslist. Sure, I gave up on a lot of going out and socializing. But I enjoyed it, and it taught me a great deal that no degree or education can ever teach you.

Shayne, Your right. In my case, my base was my parents. But it wasn't through finances. It was through a humble up-bringing and opening my eyes to the world.

 

[goodoldboy]

But they want the latest iphone, latest watches, New Cars and the latest clothes. They go out, splurge on restaurants, live week by week

I think you're confusing being broke with being poor.you've seen your peers making bad choices but they're eating in restaurants not waiting tables.
Being hard up while you're at college & making sacrifices is easy because you know or hope it's temporary.
I read that 65% if US households couldn't find 500 dollars in an emergency , they'd have to borrow.Also research has shown that the stress caused by financial woes causes a drop in cognitive abilities.
Yes you're right some can make it out of poverty but the underlying problem us structural.Blaming the poor is always the answer given by the wealthiest.

 

[Beau]

I read that 65% if US households couldn't find 500 dollars in an emergency , they'd have to borrow.Also research has shown that the stress caused by financial woes causes a drop in cognitive abilities.
Yes you're right some can make it out of poverty but the underlying problem us structural.Blaming the poor is always the answer given by the wealthiest.

That statistic sounds about right, and a lot of people I work with seem to fall into that category. But these are people who are also making $40,000+ a year. I hear them complaining about there financial position, meeting rent on time, medical expenses, caring for their children ect. But at the same time, these people will spend $100 on a night out no problem, they'll have the latest Iphone, they'll have a brand new car on a lease payment they struggle to make payments on. They'll go out there way to rent a home with spare bedrooms, and a nice large pool. And again, I could go on. These are the people that make a large proportion of that statistic you mentioned which is why I take those stats with caution.

Right now in the states, I work in Banking. If you have a bit of common sense and a good work ethic, our Bank would welcome you as a Bank teller with open arms, no matter your age. The problem we are finding is a majority of candidates just don't want to work hard. A lot of these folks are the younger generations.

I'm not necessary blaming the poor. But in my opinion, in what I see, a lot of life choices put people in a poor position to crawl there way out of poverty. It's never going to be easy but like I mentioned neither is it impossible. Everyone's wired differently and what pops to mind is that story about this father and his three sons. He gave them all $100 and they all did something different with them with various outcomes. This isn't exactly life because we don't all start off equal but even if we did, the world would still be covered in poverty.

 

[Higgy]

The problem we are finding is a majority of candidates just don't want to work hard. A lot of these folks are the younger generations.
This statement reminded me of something i noticed over the years.. Every year we would get Students from the local Agricultural College come to the Farm looking for work during Harvest... Very long hours / weekends/ and definitely No days off.... But for the last couple of years i worked at the Farm i would go to the College and try to recruit the students for the Harvest... They just didnt seem bothered anymore to earn some very good money. It was maybe only 5yrs when i noticed that it had changed from Turning students away.. To not being able to get any Students... Its the same at the Marina Now, The young lads that come and go is incredible . Il go in the office and say "Oh where is Tom/ Bob/ Whoever" ..Oh he phoned in, hes not coming any more.. To me it seems a great life for a young Lad on a Marina, Taking all kinds of boats out on the river or the sea ... Learning how to tie Knots / Laces... I dont Know they just dont seem bothered anymore

 

[goodoldboy]

Poverty is mostly a direct result of economic policy.Yes ignorance & poor choices can make things worse.Celebrity culture has indeed promoted the idea of getting rich quickly without working for it.Also more young people live at home because rents are too expensive.Aged18 I didn't want to return home which concentrated the mind somewhat regarding sticking out a job I hated.Also only 20% of my income went to rent.
Again Beau $40 000 a year puts you in the 70tg percentile of US wage earners.The people who clean your building & workplace & serve up your coffee are on minimum wage & can barely afford to live let alone spunk 100 bucks on a night out.
Poverty a a foreseeable consequence of policy.The real wages of ordinary workers has not risen since the mid 70s.200K is the minimum you need to buy a house in the village I was born & rents reflect this.For a couple with 2 kids both earning average wages you can imagine after mortgage car payments , tax etc.there's not alot of slack.