Starter wont disengage from flywheel

[Rob]

I've been having starting issues recently, first of all with both batteries showing 12v on the multimeter it wont turn over. I hit the starter a few times and it finally engages and turns over really slowly. More recently when it does engage and start the starter does not disengage from the fly wheel (but it does not turn over like the starter contact issue we all know about). I can tell that this is happening due to the very distinctive metallic rattling noise (like a really worn ball bearing) coming from the starter/bell housing. This gradually gets louder and louder and so I try to turn engine on and off until it disengages. Interestingly when doing this the starter turns over at normal speeds.

This problem began to surface after I got stuck in some deep muddy water almost to the bonnet for a good 15min before I could winch myself out. I did not turn the engine off when in the water for obvious reasons. The batteries were replaced about 3 months ago and I have replaced the starter contacts 14 months ago (including solenoid plunger). Do I need a new starter or can it be cleaned out/refurbed. Could it be something else. Where can I get a new Denso starter from?

 

[Paul_Humphreys]

Strip-clean-rebuild-test. Is the way I would go.

Paul

 

[Chris]

Agree with Paul really Rob. Hypothetical diagnosis is always difficult. I'd get the spanners out and whip it off and take it apart. I have a spare (broken) starter in my garage. I stripped it completely. Other than the delicate wire in the solenoid, there aren't any tricky bits that I can remember. I might have to take mine off too as mine seems to clatter every so often. The Bendix drive probably needs a schlep of grease on there. Nothing very clever in there. It's really just a motor.

Chris

 

[Rob]

Thanks for the advice guys, will do it next weekend

 

[Rob]

Well look what I found:

No amount of elbow grease will fix that.

And so I look at my 18 month old starter contacts and I find out why the solenoid is not operating smoothly

I decided to take the whole starter apart to see what else needs replacing

I then checked on Toyodiy that you cant buy the output gear on its own, you need to get the whole clutch assembly which it lists at €179 Why do Toyota do this? all I need is a single gear which you need to take off to anyway to remove the clutch assembly. There wasnt much mud in the motor but it had still managed to make its way in there and because all the bearings have no shields they need changing. Seems the culprit is:

I would strongly recommend changing these when you do the starter contacts as one of mine seemed to have some dirt in it and as a result it did not close up when submerged. Looks like I will need a new (used) starter with new contacts and "breathers" as I am not willing to sink over £200 into this one. Any recommendations for other alternatives?

BTW a manual impact driver is one the best tools ever, thanks for the tip Chris

 

[Chris]

Ahh, you made it to Halfrauds then Rob. I could see the new acquisition in the pic. Glad I could help. The starter pinion does look absolutely knackered doesn't it.

Chris

 

[Jon Wildsmith]

I think your solenoid sticking is why you have that gear damage Rob. Did you look at the fly wheel as well to check that's ok? What sort of condition is the solenoid end plate gasket in because even allowing for playing in the mud and a blocked drain that looks an excessive amount of crud.

 

[Rob]

The flywheel looks fine but I have not cranked the engine over to check the whole thing. Looks like the starter gear is the sacrificial component.

Has anybody had their starter fill with mud before? Seems like a very odd thing to happen to a serious off road vehicle.

 

[Rob]

I think your solenoid sticking is why you have that gear damage Rob.

The solenoid would not return to its off position as it was jammed up with mud. It still doesn't operate properly as i have not cleaned out the clutch assembly.

 

[Rob]

What sort of condition is the solenoid end plate gasket in because even allowing for playing in the mud and a blocked drain that looks an excessive amount of crud.

Sorry missed this bit, its in good condition, definitely did not come in that way. The rubber drain was filled with mud so it must have gone in that way.

 

[Dave2000]

The flywheel looks fine but I have not cranked the engine over to check the whole thing. Looks like the starter gear is the sacrificial component.

The engine tends to stop in the same one or two positions when it is switched off, as you said a good look all round is needed. While you are under the bonnet check all the earths or better still fit a new one for the cost, I have seen bad earths causing a lot of arcing, heating and ultimately welding together of the starter contacts.

regards

Dave

 

[Rob]

What earths need checking or where are they?

 

[frank rabbets]

Yes I would like to find my engine to chassis earth but cannot find it.

Frank

 

[Dave2000]

Just follow the battery leads and you will soon find them, the norm is to have one earth cable from battery to engine however, halfway along the cable the insulation is stripped back and another terminal added to bolt on to the body.

regards

Dave

 

[Rob]

New starter and it seems to be sorted! Thanks Karl

 

[karl webster]

All good mate