End of diesel overland travelling in Europe.

MetalDonkey Jul 21, 2018

  1. moggy1968

    moggy1968 Well-Known Member

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    Unfortunately the flaw in that is that you are looking at simple emissions, the figures I looked at were estimates of what we actually breathe in, and most of us spend more time in our homes than our cars and modern homes lack adequate ventilation so that’s why the exposure in the home is so high.

    It’s like saying that sitting in your car in the garage with the garage door shut and the engine running you’re no more likely to die than driving down the road because the emissions are the same, clearly not because the concentration of gas is so much higher it will do you more harm. An extreme example I know but it illustrates the point.

    The genetics thing is a valid point. It is now thought that cancer is due to a defective anti cancer gene. Some people have a genetic predisposition, some don’t. What your doing though is playing the percentages game. Let’s take as example 1000 smokers, all smoke 20 a day. All other lifestyle factors are normalised. 10% die in accidents. 20% of them die before 50 due to smoking related diseases, another 30% before 70, another 30% before 80, bit 10% grow old and die of something unrelated to smoking. They all took the same risks but because of their genetic predisposition the effect of their lifestyle choices has a different effect. Sure, you can go through life smoking 20 a day and live until you’re 98, bit you’re loading the probability dice against yourself. If your overweight, have a bad diet, work shifts, have a stressful job and drink too much then you load the dice up more.
    Interestingly research done on Egyptian mummies showed no evidence of cancerous changes even on old age, ancwr appears to be a fairly modern phenomenon.
    Disclaimer - before anyone asks me to evidence those figures I made them up to illustrate the point!
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2019
    clivehorridge and Chas like this.
  2. leeloo

    leeloo Member I am in romania

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    In Brussels they had some air quality monitors, some placed on main arteries, near tunnels, etc.. almost all day, specially in the winter, on red .
    The problem was solved by removing them, now they have them somewhere in parcs, on the outskirts.. so, since then, the air quality improved a lot and Brussels is no longer fined for the poor air quality it has .. :)
    That being said, , after promoting diesel a lot in Belgium, for may many years, now in 2021 I will have to sell my Land cruiser because I won't be able to enter the city at all. The other option will be to move ut of the city and comute for like 2 h each way every day wich is also a bit unacceptable for me.
    I am not talking about a small area like the London congestion tax, witch only covers the Center, and I would agree to that, here it is the whole city, what ever is inside the ring, and this is exaggerated.
    I drive a hybrid to work, and the Land cruiser on week-end and holidays, but that does not matter to them.

    This is why I am also very limited with the modifications I would like to make. I don't know why toyota is not selling the 2.7 L petrol in Europe at all, I would buy it just for piece of mind.
    The only option I will have 2021 will be a Hilux, since it is a pick -up it is also taxed differently.
     
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  3. Higgy

    Higgy Well-Known Member Supporter I am in denmark

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    What are the laws regarding Diesels in London these days... Iv kinda lost touch /Interest. some one wants me to fetch a boat from Putney with the Trailer... I did mention the LEZ to the customer but im not sure about the 120 Its a LC5 04 reg..It use to be exempt but im not so sure now. Did they change it?
     
  4. Chas

    Chas Well-Known Member Supporter I am in england

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    If it's of any help, this is the last pic I have of the current ULEZ map. Putney is inside the zone.

    ULEZ map.jpg
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2019
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  5. moggy1968

    moggy1968 Well-Known Member

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    You can go online, enter your vehicle details and they will tell you if it’s allowed in or not.
    As far as I am aware the LEZ applies to commercials and campervans (why???) only, not private cars but don’t quote me on that.
     
  6. flint

    flint Well-Known Member Supporter

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  7. Higgy

    Higgy Well-Known Member Supporter I am in denmark

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    The last time i went to that same marina in Putney I was in my old 3.1 Trooper SWB commercial... They Hammered me for that one...
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2019
  8. Higgy

    Higgy Well-Known Member Supporter I am in denmark

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    Just done the check and it came back with...'Your Vehicle is Subject to ULEZ...Then it goes on to say As of April 1st 2019.. Bla Bla Bla! Your vehicle will be subject to ULEZ....:?..I put my REG in for the LEZ and it came back with.. Your Vehicle is Subject to the £200 a day LEZ charge..I guess he can sail his boat back.. Id have to charge Him over £400 just to make a tiny Profit.... Not worth the Agro
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2019
  9. Higgy

    Higgy Well-Known Member Supporter I am in denmark

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    Is a Landcruiser classed as a Specialised Vehicle then?
     
  10. StarCruiser

    StarCruiser Well-Known Member Supporter Guru I am in uk

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    I’ve just entered my Reg on the 80 here https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/driving/low-emission-zone/check-if-your-vehicle-is-affected?intcmp=2266
    and it returned that it was exempt. However I also went through the wizard and it told me I drove a van that was chargeable. I’m going by the Reg.
     
  11. Higgy

    Higgy Well-Known Member Supporter I am in denmark

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    Yeh i put the 80 reg in as well and it all came back the same as the 120.... Put the missus 61 plate skoda fabia in That was LEZ exempt ..... But subject to ULEZ charges come April 8 2019... This is a car that the emissions were so low, that its only £20 a year to tax... WTF...
     
  12. StarCruiser

    StarCruiser Well-Known Member Supporter Guru I am in uk

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    Mine would be ULEZ non compliant. But I’m not going there. I can’t see why one cruiser should be subject to it and another not.

    Just don’t you go thinking it’s a money making scheme now will you! It’s to save people’s lives you know!!
     
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  13. StarCruiser

    StarCruiser Well-Known Member Supporter Guru I am in uk

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    The other interesting thing is that it doesn’t seem to matter if you run on bio or derv.

    It says to register your vehicle if you believe it has been wrongly classified.
     
  14. Higgy

    Higgy Well-Known Member Supporter I am in denmark

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    I was just reading through more Blurb.. And basically given time if its not Electric... Your Gonna get charged Eventually....
     
  15. Jacob100

    Jacob100 Well-Known Member Supporter I am in uk

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    An urban planner on the radio earlier made the point that you’d be naive to think that a ban on private motoring in cities is a wishy-washy European concept. Again China is leading the way.
     
  16. Dave_S

    Dave_S Well-Known Member

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    Cut a hole in the floor and run when in the city - Fred Flintsone style - must be eco friendly enough for the nut cases.
     
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  17. GeekOKent

    GeekOKent Well-Known Member Supporter I am in uk

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    Haven't had an electric outage since we moved in. Mind you having said that, I bet power fails on the weekend. We don't really have candles that get lit with the kids around anyway.
     
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  18. GeekOKent

    GeekOKent Well-Known Member Supporter I am in uk

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  19. StarCruiser

    StarCruiser Well-Known Member Supporter Guru I am in uk

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    I did wonder if that might be the case.
     
  20. moggy1968

    moggy1968 Well-Known Member

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    As per the conversation I had with my taxi driver that I wrote about earlier.
    As I understand it basically all diesels will be barred from the ULEZ, regardless of their actual emissions, but his old Bentley that does 9mpg will be fine. Go figure!!
     
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