Absolutely Gutted In Morocco

[Julian T]

I intend to add some additional mechanism to my next overland car to ensure that the bonnet catch can be released from outside the car regardless of the state of the existing wire.

I have often thought of adding a second cable, or additional linkage, to the mech that would be accessible from underneath and positioned near the winch so as not to be noticeable.

 

[Shayne]

Hope you didn't take my post the wrong way Byron my comment was meant for Mark mostly as we have the same 90 series catch and i wouldn't have known had i not had problems with it in the past that the first few inches of cable though hidden is loose and accessible .

 

[MarkW]

Decided against taking mine of in the current sand storms. I leave that investigation for home I think

 

[clivehorridge]

There must be a way to re-engineer the 80 catch to operate from outside of the truck.

Of course, as an anti theft device, the OEM set up is more ideal, but for a specialist overland truck, functionality must come first.

Has anyone considered what it is that causes the OEM cable to fail under fire conditions? I would speculate that the outer casing is plastic coated, and the outer cable gripper is gripping the plastic. Thus, when the plastic melts, the lever pressure on the inner would simply slide the outer along (with an ineffective gripper) instead of operating the catch.

I may have this all wrong, because I need to look how it functions, but it may be an idea to modify the OEM (with or without an external set-up) to stop the heat induced "fail" from failing.

 

[StarCruiser]

It's a thought Clive, there's metal to metal Bowden cables available, used on mowers as throttle cables with a solid inner.

 

[Shayne]

I imagine if you cut a cable that's what you will find Rich same as a pushbike brake . My guess is heat melts the plastic outer creating resistance on a cable already suffering about 5ft of resistance when its working properly , and we have what - an inch long plastic lever in the cabin to overcome the resistance with .

I wonder if a cable clamp that allows us to attach a loop to the cable at the back of the lever so you can put your foot in it would over come the resistance ?

 

[ByronJ]

Hope you didn't take my post the wrong way Byron my comment was meant for Mark mostly as we have the same 90 series catch and i wouldn't have known had i not had problems with it in the past that the first few inches of cable though hidden is loose and accessible .

Not at all Shayne . I know you have a 90 and all ideas and information are helpful.

 

[StarCruiser]

I imagine if you cut a cable that's what you will find Rich same as a pushbike brake . My guess is heat melts the plastic outer creating resistance on a cable already suffering about 5ft of resistance when its working properly , and we have what - an inch long plastic lever in the cabin to overcome the resistance with .

I wonder if a cable clamp that allows us to attach a loop to the cable at the back of the lever so you can put your foot in it would over come the resistance ?

Some simple cables are plastic tubes with a wire or wire rope in the middle.

 

[moggy1968]

All those involved in the military or emergency services will know that drills and playing the whatif game are essential tools in survival, so all this discussion is very helpful in adding 'clubs to your golf bag' I for one really value the discussion on this terrible event in the hopes it might help someone else 9r me) if they are unfortunate enough to be caught in a similar situation.
The 2 things I will take away from this are looking at a way to open the bonnet seperate to the bonnet catch (interested to see solutions on this) and the importance of a grab bag. Ironic after the other post on the guy doing vehicle support on extreme expeditions and the rule of threes

https://www.landcruiserclub.net/community/threads/an-interesting-watch-for-4x4-traverlers.147680/

 

[Gary Stockton]

Could always remove the OEM mechanism altogether and use the rally mechanism with studs up through the bonnet from where front adjustable supports are. Put a padlock on for security....

 

[frank rabbets]

That's right Gary, do what the specialists in that area do. Protocol has already been established. If you need too much modification you,re taking on too much or going in the wrong vehicle.

 

[Shayne]

I believe rally cars and the like have removable bonnets to facilitate a quick engine swap , from vague memory a long time ago they had a pull and twist lever in the cab to flood the engine bay with extinguisher . I've no idea how it worked but its easy to assume a sprinkler system very similar to our window washer .

 

[StarCruiser]

There's all sorts Shayne. They have to carry these things to comply with the rulings and be able to take part. I'll ask my buddy with the rally car where's best to get these bits.

They also have a loop of cable with "Cut here" marks so that Marshall's can disable the electrics if they cannot get to the isolator pull handle for any reason. This seems to me to be a very simple way to isolate batteries on a cruiser by taking short loops somewhere accessible that can be cut with wire croppers.

 

[Chris]

Rich, I was on exactly the same wavelength. I bought a pair of cable cutters in Maplin which slice through 50mm welding cable with ease. It may not be the ONLY answer, but I'm going to get a new par and have them next to my life hammer in the car. In an emergency I won't be looking for a 10mm spanner to undo the glowing cable. Snip and it's done. There's enough slack to be able to rig something up to get me going again if the car is still drivable. I am wary of anything other than very high quality and expensive isolators. All of the ones I've had including Albright etc have been rubbish and led to more problems than they solved. The bonnet release is worth talking through but how many times has this actually happened? There needs to be a mixture of measures doesn't there. No good getting the lid up if you've no way of fighting fire. No good fighting the fire if the main cables are glowing red still.

 

[MarkW]

Failure of the bonnet release is very common with engine fires. The firemen who attended the scene confirmed as much and a quick look on google reveals quite a lot of discussion on how to deal with a stuck bonnet from the fire people.

 

[Chris]

My point is that rather than trying to invent a new bonnet release why don't we just make the existing one more reliable. Wooden houses used to burn down. They don't solve that by living in caves did they. They built houses that didn't burn. Have a look at this item. If it's hollow, why not sheath the cable in it?

https://www.glowing-embers.co.uk/st...id=CL-o8vjbzNMCFUK4Gwod1NcBfg#RoyalMailExport

 

[MarkW]

Or just use some of the easily available heat proof tubing used in motorsport to protect it.

Of course if we knew why the bonnetvtelease fails under heat the solution would be much easier.

Gary's idea with the bonnet pins is the simplest option. And they are available as a locking version

 

[StarCruiser]

How about a key lock like a locker lock in the grille attached by a flexi wire to the bonnet release directly. Secure and pretty indestructible.

 

[Shayne]

It's just a gate latch and i reckon you would be lucky to get within 30ft of the blaze by the time the catch itself failed .
The cable either stretches or jams me thinks and all the cable does is lift a sprung latch .

 

[moggy1968]

Rich, I was on exactly the same wavelength. I bought a pair of cable cutters in Maplin which slice through 50mm welding cable with ease. It may not be the ONLY answer, but I'm going to get a new par and have them next to my life hammer in the car. In an emergency I won't be looking for a 10mm spanner to undo the glowing cable. Snip and it's done. There's enough slack to be able to rig something up to get me going again if the car is still drivable. I am wary of anything other than very high quality and expensive isolators. All of the ones I've had including Albright etc have been rubbish and led to more problems than they solved. The bonnet release is worth talking through but how many times has this actually happened? There needs to be a mixture of measures doesn't there. No good getting the lid up if you've no way of fighting fire. No good fighting the fire if the main cables are glowing red still.

Just make sure they're properly electrically insulated cutters, not tin snips!!