Rope / manual winch - what strength to get?

[Matt Wright]

Hi all

I'm looking at the manual / hand winches online and would like to know which strength is recommended for an 80 series loaded up - I'm guessing she'll weigh in at 3.5 tonnes when fully laden (she's 2850kg's right now). The reason for the hand winch is that a) I don't have a front winch bumper and can't afford one.. b) if we get stuck there's a large possibility it might be face first so the front winch won't be as useful as the moveable winch..
The front winches don't seem to be thaaat much more expensive given that it's electric and there are some decent looking ones that include plasma rope for £400 all in, anyway

The manual winch options on eBay look like there's 800kg, 1600kg and 3200kg pulling rating. I'm not too phased with the lift as I don't think I can lift her!!

These are some of the contenders..
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... K:MEWAX:IT
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/DRAPER-71208-EXPE ... 483826cfb7
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/1600kg-Tirfor-Typ ... 2a0b13059a

Any help appreciated! Thanks a lot..
(I could always a Rubie winch )

 

[Julian]

Manual winches do have some pretty big pluses,
You can winch from any direction
They pretty much always work
They don't flatten your battery
They work with the engine off
Biggest disadvantage is that they are hard work

I would go with the biggest one

 

[Matt Wright]

Thanks Julian - I guess the 3200 I is then, time to go see what they cost.

It'll be a good work out......

 

[Jon Wildsmith]

You want a 1600Kg Matt, not the biggest one, which you'll find heavy and larger than you expected! check their pulling spec not their lifting spec

 

[Chris]

...and in truth, the weight of your vehicle isn't really the most crucial factor. You aren't lifting it. OK, it's a component, but stuck is stuck and that's the force that you are trying to overcome. The tension on the rope could be enormous even for a lighter vehicle. I'd rather see you with a proper winch myself. Maybe a demountable one that would go back or front. They can mount onto a towball and be run from flying leads. Just a thought. Getting a towball attachment for the front wouldn't be difficult. All you need is a mate who can weld!

Chris

 

[sae70]

STOP STOP STOP

Before you buy one consider this

How much do they weigh
How much room do they take up
When did you last need to winch yourself out of trouble in a hurry

If your stuck & some form of hand winching operation is your only option then does it matter how long it takes so long as it gets you out of trouble

Do you not already carry a Hi-Lift Jack

If so why not buy yourself a Hi-Lift Off road kit http://www.hi-lift.com/accessories/off-road-kit.html it's only £80ish Weighs nothing compared to a Tirfor or equivilent & comes in a handy little bag all ready to go So long as you don't rig it up as Hi-Lift suggests it works really really well & actually takes no time atall

With over 100 years of quality, the Hi-Lift Jack is a rugged, highly versatile jack that puts you in command of situations requiring lifting, pushing, pulling, winching, and clamping. Although light in weight and easy to maneuver, the Hi-Lift Jack offers a rated capacity of 4,660 lbs (2114 kg) and a tested capacity of 7,000 lbs (3175 kg).

 

[Jon Wildsmith]

ooh, you've started something now Matt

 

[Matt Wright]

I see that Thanks for the tip Steven, I'm reading now...

PS, I don't have a high lift jack yet. Living in London where there are no real shops (off road!!), I am restricted to eBay deliveries so we're been planning to go out in to the real world and pick up a jack (else you have to get friends to fetch yr gear all over the country and bring it to Lincomb Thanks Chris!)

brb...

 

[Paul]

And can be used like this........

 

[sae70]

And can be used like this........

Nice demonstration there Paul not just of another use but also showing that so long as you have a bit of chain a couple of shackles & a strop you actually don't need the Off Road Kit to provide you with emergency winching capability In actual fact some of the Off Road Kit is all a bit fussy anyways & I personally don't agree with how Hi-Lift sujest it should be used

Can't believe that you don't have a Hi-Lift Essential kit IMHO

 

[Matt Wright]

Is that using the special kit Paul? or just normal?

I've never been stuck and used one of these so please excuse my ignorance (always been pulled out using ropes! not even been winched out yet!).

And, what pulling distance does the high lift jack offer before it needs to be unhooked? - hence the reason for the special kit which avoids this.

Must say, the HLJ kit does look convincing...

Looks like : A front winch [Gav ] and a high lift with the kit.. OR
A moveable electric winch OR
Just the hand winch.

I really have started something!

 

[Jon Wildsmith]

For a Hi Lift type jack to be much use to you for lifting, your truck needs to have places you can shove the jack under, I can't remember if you have sliders or a front winch bumper Matt? Without any training be very careful how you use it.

 

[Julian]

Matt, I am guilty of not reading your whole thread, I picked the last link and assumed it was the biggest. As Jon said 1600kg will be perfect
Now to the whole Hi-lift thing IMHO yes they can be used as a rudimentary winch, but why wouldn't you use a winch?
The only time I personally would use one is if it was the last thing I had OR if I was trying to winch in 2 directions simultaneously.
Winches can be pretty dangerous, I have a friend who lost a few fingers in one

 

[Paul]

That was on a training course and was not actually recovering a vehicle but more about moving it sideways to avoid a tree. Special Greg course from Landcruisers overland.
It is limited on pulling distance and needs another strap if having to get another bite, i quite like the tirfor idea as my winch just broke

 

[Cptsideways]

I have a dinky little Tirfor that will generally get you out of most things, albeit slowly! A hi lift is great but they can also bloody dangerous if not handled properly

 

[24Seven]

Here we go even more

A Tirfor is a useful bit of kit, winch bumpers, electric winches and a Hilift jack is just expensive off roading bling IMO.

 

[sae70]

For a Hi Lift type jack to be much use to you for lifting, your truck needs to have places you can shove the jack under, I can't remember if you have sliders or a front winch bumper Matt?

Ah well what you need there is a Lift-M8

Here Iam stuck Can't go forwards or backwards Open diffs a So out with the Hi-Lift & Lift-M8 to get the wheel up waffle underneath ontop of lump of wood & journey continues No worries about second batteries, electric winches, extra weight is going to work how often should I be servicing it will I be better off with Plasma

Actually its two waffles & no wood this time

 

[Matt Wright]

Hi guys

A genuine thank you for all the advice - especially seeing how tricky a situation it is. There will be best fitted pieces of kit for differing circumstances and I think the reason I asked initially was to see if there was a "low hanging piece of fruit" to solve as much of the getting stuck problem as possible.
My motto has always been "avoid getting stuck if far from home and give it a bit more stick when you have other trucks around / are close to home"

On the trip, we will have neither so I'll do some digging and let you guys know what I end up fitting to the truck.. She looks almost "bare" at the moment cause I have specifically avoided loading it up with gear for the sake of it and to "look like an overland truck" and focused on using your expert help to get the mechanics in the best shape possible

Will let you know how I get on
Ps, At present I have a standard front bumper which is getting Gav fabbed stiffer straps made up
The rear has a strong tow hitch
the sides have aluminium rails which are good for standing on..

 

[sae70]

Using the Hi-Lift as a winch as described buy Hi-Lift using their Off Road Kit is a bit of a game involving removing the base plate & all kinds of attachments needing spanners & I'd agree it's not the best solution But there is another company in Oz http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSPbDwnUC-M selling a kit to adapt the Hi-Lift for winching that is far simpler enabling the base plate to remain on the jack & the top choker chain that is attached to the top of the Hi-Lift/tree strop can be used as a safety chain to stop your truck running back down the hill should a shear pin go in the Hi-Lift I've no also rigged all of mine using quick release items so no spannering required to fit or remove

This is how Hi-Lift suggest rigging it

And this is how I rig it

This is another interesting link on the subject http://forum.difflock.com/viewtopic.php ... 7cdf1a5e85

 

[Jon Wildsmith]

Ah well what you need there is a Lift-M8

Ok so long as you have access to the side of the vehicle I can only think of 1 time that would have worked for me as I'm usually in a bit of a tight spot if I need help